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World Of Warcraft and Kids... Not a Great Idea

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World Of Warcraft and Kids... Not a Great Idea

The treadmill effect.

from JoeUser Forums

*inspired by this article

     For those of you who are unfamiliar with the terms used here lets start with MMORPG. That acronym stands for Massively Multiplayer Online Role Playing Game. These games are played remotely by millions of players every day. Some of the examples include Everquest (EQ or EverCrack), Ultima Online (UO), and most recently World of Warcraft (WoW). There are others of course and they all vary in terms of game mechanics, scope, and milieu but they all share one core game mechanic : the treadmill.

     The treadmill is the Pavlovian system of action = reward that keeps a gamer gaming. It takes the form of incremental intrinsic character improvements, equipment finds, or even appearance changes. The goal in designing an MMORPG is to give the player "one more thing" to do or get at all times. There is always another skill to impove, a level to gain, or a rare piece of equipment to quest after.

     This system is so well designed and implemented in so many overlapping layers that it is very common to spend far more time playing the game than you think you have spent. After all it will just take another 5 minutes to accomplish that next micro-goal right? Of course that micrro-accomplpisment and it's accompanying reward produce a pretty gratifying feeling of progress and sucess so whats 5 more minutes... and 5 more... and 15 more to group up and camp that boss monster who drops that ultra-rare set of boots that woudl complete that set I have been collecting and... so on.

     I have nothing against this style of gaming, in fact I think they are high art as gaming goes. Games are meant to be compelling and enjoyable and these games are all of that and a bag of holding but they are not a good idea for children.

     Do you think that a 9 or 10 year old has the ability to fend off Pavlov's cycle as I have just described it? Do you think that a 14 year old boy who has all the angst of that age might be able to fend off the feeling that the only progress in their life is the progression they make playing WoW? Think that they are resisting all that cyber-sex chat and simulated character sex going on in their server when they can't get a date in real life? If you do you might be retarded. Get checked out at the doctor and then come back and finish this article.

     The above paragraph is actually the less serious concern here. The fact of the matter is that if your teen or pre-teen is playing WoW then you are letting them have unsupervised Internet interactions with shitloads of adults. Go and check out some WoW player sites for all the cyber-sex, photoexchanges, online "hook-ups", and other unsavory *adult* shit that goes on here.

     Would you let you son/daughter spend 5-30 hours or more a week in adult chatrooms? Would you? Well thats what WoW is folks. It is a playground primarliy made for adults. Adults are the ones with the cash to support the MMORPG industry... not kids.

     If your kid is playing MMORPG's you are taking massive risks in terms of both addiction possibilities and also in terms of allowing them to interact with adults unsupervised. If you are an adult playing this stuff great! Bully for you Elven Ranger Bob! I could give a fuck less where you choose to spend your time. But parents... your kids can't not defend themselves as well as adults against this sort of thing. You have to do it. Be the parent, not their buddy.

 

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Reply #26 from JoeUser Forums Top
I say it's better to create our own reality where people are treated with the fairness that they deserve. So let's start immersing ourselves even further. Let's plug our children into machines, where the world won't disappoint and wound them emotionally and physically. It's the only fair thing to do.


You are obviously joking or delusional.

I am raising my son to be a man in the REAL WORLD. Last time I checked gaming doesn't teach you how to shake hands, address your peers face to face, dress for success, nourish you with food, debate in a constructive way, drive a car, date a girl, give you any skills you can make a living doing without supplemental skills you learn OFF the computer, and LIFE IS NOT FAIR!....the list goes on and on.

It always cracks me up that people want life to be fair. I sure as heck don't. Fair would mean that every time I screwed up, I would be screwed. I don't know about you but I like the idea of forgiveness and NOT getting what I deserve sometimes. Unless you are perfect, having a world that is "fair" is not something you should wish too hard for...imo.



Someone who should be level 75 within our "reality" is actually made level 3.


I dunno about this. It is my experience people who THINK they are a level 75 in real life are usually about a level 3. Probably because they are too busy thinking the world unfair and playing video games to ever increase their social skills enough to move on up. Being a 75 in REAL life means engaging REAL LIFE and MAKING IT HAPPEN, not sitting back playing games and poo pooing about how ideal the game world is.

Blech.
Reply #27 from JoeUser Forums Top
Thank you Dr. Spock. Thank you for telling me what's right and wrong for MY children. I don't know what I would've done without your guidance.
Galactic Civilizations IV
Reply #28 from JoeUser Forums Top

Thank you for telling me what's right and wrong for MY children.

Oh I am pretty sure you have it all figured out yourself there fucktardo.

Can the same be said about our own civlization?

Yes... I think that basically guts your argument.

Reply #29 from JoeUser Forums Top
Well, yes, I am joking. I like what you're saying, Tova7. I think it is the truth that people aren't aware of their own level. The biggest travesty, I've seen, is that the most wonderful people in the world, level 100 and above, oftem times don't know how wonderful they are. It seems as if the most awesome people are usually the ones who feel bad about themselves. Plugging children into machines really won't help them. But filling them with confidence; helping them to feel empowered; teaching them to love and respect other people as well as themselves--that's a worthy gift.
Reply #30 from JoeUser Forums Top
My knowledge of online games is extremely limited but the wisdom in Tova7's response gets an insightful from me. Applause! Applause!
Reply #31 from JoeUser Forums Top
I think you're taking a grain of truth, and trying to grow a field.

Is it possible for a child to be exposed to "cybersex" on World of Warcraft? Sure it's possible, though I never encountered it when I used to play it. Is that a reason to ban all game play (or even all unsupervised game play)? I don't think so.

It's possible for an infant to die of SIDS in their sleep, but I wouldn't recommend keeping infants indefinately awake. It's possible for a child to fall and hurt themselves on the playground, but I wouldn't stop them from playing. It's possible (no, it's PROBABLE) that your child will be exposed to all kinds of negative influences at school, but I wouldn't suggest not sending them (unless it's your perogative to homeschool for other reasons).

Pretty much everything has risk involved. I wouldn't let an 8 year old play WoW without strict supervision, but the game is rated Teen to Mature, so I wouldn't expect someone to let their 8 year old play. I don't think there is any great risk to letting a 15 or 16 yo play the game. In my experience (having played both male and female characters), the chance of them encountering anything resembling a sexual situation is a tiny fraction of the chance of such a thing in other internet media (chatrooms, etc.), the television, or even among their peers at school.
Reply #32 from JoeUser Forums Top
I forgot to mention that in your forum link that you seem to think back your argument that WoW is a haven for sexual predators, it's interesting to note that the vast majority of the respondents had never encountered the situtation described in the forum topic. I think that speaks to the fact that such a situation is the exception rather than the rule.
Reply #33 from JoeUser Forums Top

that WoW is a haven for sexual predators

Hmm a place where young boys are drawn in huge numbers through a largely anonymous forum... why would i think sexual predators might be into that?

I wouldn't let an 8 year old play WoW without strict supervision

that is the entire thrust of the article.

 

Reply #34 from JoeUser Forums Top
This is a simple argument, If you let your kids play, watch them while they do it. If you cannot watch them, do not let them play.

Chances are that your son will not cyber in front of you.

I do not like how you stereotyped ALL children and WoW. And to tell the truth I am kind of turned off to listening to you anymore due to the venomous responses you provide.

To me it just sounds like you have some kind of personal problem with it and that is why you are being so defensive
Reply #35 from JoeUser Forums Top
Needed to expand

What I am basically saying is..why would anyone take advice from you when all you are doing is calling people fucktards and assclowns. You, who is so wise as to inform people how to raise their children, cannot even spend the time and show a high maturity level in your responses, you instead resort to name calling.

While I understood your point in your first post, you lost every bit of credibility I held for you.
Reply #36 from JoeUser Forums Top

To me it just sounds like you have some kind of personal problem with it and that is why you are being so defensive

Yeah my kid plays 300 hours a day. Or not. Maybe i have a problems with posters who can't be bothered to read the entirety of the article or the commentary that comes after it? You know the bit where we already discussed supervision?

While I understood your point in your first post, you lost every bit of credibility I held for you.

I am crushed.

Reply #37 from JoeUser Forums Top
I did, in fact, read your article in its entirety, as well as all of the responses.

I appreciate you supporting my point. Thanks

Reply #38 from JoeUser Forums Top

I did, in fact, read your article in its entirety, as well as all of the responses.

so you just didn't grasp the content of the very first comment or the discussion that followed?

Reply #39 from Stardock Forums Top
It seems that Caracarn stated very clearly that (s)he was in agreement with you.
This is a simple argument, If you let your kids play, watch them while they do it. If you cannot watch them, do not let them play.

Chances are that your son will not cyber in front of you.

Then (s)he comments on how you present your agruements.

So who didn't grasp what?
Reply #40 from JoeUser Forums Top
Well, yes, I am joking. I like what you're saying, Tova7


Whew you had me a-scared there for a minute!
Reply #41 from JoeUser Forums Top
My knowledge of online games is extremely limited but the wisdom in Tova7's response gets an insightful from me. Applause! Applause!


Hey thanks!!
Reply #42 from JoeUser Forums Top
Well all ass-clowning aside thanks for giving me a heads up. I don't play, my husband doesn't play, so I now know a few things to be vigilant over.

Cyber sex may not be huge and occur often, but it just so happens I have some of the worst luck in America, so it would pop up for my kid, I can almost bank on it. But not so much now....forewarned and all that.
Reply #43 from JoeUser Forums Top

So who didn't grasp what?

 

catch up new guy... caracran had a couple of different anonymous log-ins... thanks for playing.

Reply #44 from JoeUser Forums Top
I never knew what the MMO stood for. I know what an RPG is but I am more familiar with like Final Fantasy and stuff, and not even that online. This articale was very interesting- I agree there should be some sort of age check to play some of these games if anything in your article is true.
[email protected]
Reply #45 from JoeUser Forums Top
To be completely honest and clear up your misunderstanding, Caracarn is the only name I go by. I have no need to mask my thoughts with a different name. The other anonymous users are not me.

Seems like I am not the one having a "grasping" problem. Thanks.
Reply #46 from JoeUser Forums Top

To be completely honest and clear up your misunderstanding

Stop posting as anonymous and that will have some more cred here.

Reply #47 from GalCiv2 Forums Top
How can you tell that these ananymous posts belong to a particular person? That is certainly beyond my knowledge and level of use in any forums much less this one.
By the way thank you for calming your language .
Reply #48 from JoeUser Forums Top
Stop posting as anonymous and that will have some more cred here.


Ask and ye shall receive
Reply #49 from JoeUser Forums Top

Ask and ye shall receive

Welcome to JU!  Hope your stay is enjoyable.