Vasari Rebel Star Base cheaper and better than titan.

Just to point out that the Vasari Rebel Titan is currently quite possibly the strongest Titan in the entire game. Nanoleech is so broken right now that attacking the thing with frigates/cruisers (that aren't carriers) only makes it stronger. People in beta were using it by itself to fight 1000+ supply fleets, and winning.

Besides that, you can only attack with one Starbase at a time. So why not augment it with the Titan?

Just because the VR Titan eats frigates for breakfast does it mean it is OP? Perhaps throwing frigates against it is just the wrong strategy, on purpose. Like trying to destroy flak with strike craft.

What if it goes face-to-face with a starbase?

How many capital ships are needed to destroy the VR Titan without frigate/cruiser support on both sides?

Those are all valid comparisons which, depending on the answer, can validate or refute the 'OMG IT'S OP BBQ' claim.

Might be able to take down a fleet of frigs/cruisers, but my level 7 reb titan went toe to toe with the TEC titan for a good half an hour with no winner. In that time the TEC titan also took out the Star Base that was augmenting the titan's front, had to pull out eventually just couldn't break it's tank and my titan was needed in other places.

1. reb starbases aren't OP, decent sized fleet will floor it in a matter of seconds if done right.

2. Reb Titan certainly isn't op, don't throw frigs at it. Titan's are SUPPOSED to eat small ships, try defending a titan push... with a Titan. Thats what they're there for.

So you think it being able to single handidly wipe out massive fleets because over half the ships in the game flat out don't work against it isn't OP? Really? You think it's intended behavior that nothing smaller then a capital ship should be brought to fight this thing because doing so actively helps it?

As for a Starbase... it'll be fine. When you run all your ships away (because if they're around this thing will have no problem with a Starbase since it's got snacks), the other guy will just bring in some ships and kill the Starbase. Or since it's Vasari Rebels just bring in our dear friend Orkulus Rex.

This is what we call a ...of course, many of you wouldn't know that since the Official Troll Guide was not stickied...

I agree that the purpose of the Kultorask is to force your opponent to think strategically by not bringing in massed frigate army to face it, that being said however nano leech is way to op atm as even if you are using your cap ships it drains your am and you really can't kill that thing, and as tridus said if you are stuck in a fight with that thing and then they bring it orkulus it is very much over because even if you have sb and supporting structures the disintegrator arrays will take everything down

One human vs. a million household ants can still stomp them into oblivion. If the human uses one of its 'abilities', such as the yellow rain or some gasoline, the ants are dead in no time. Talk about OP.

Strategy is just that, strategy. You can't complain that a gatling gun of a million rubber bands cannot penetrate a concrete wall. You have to either work your way around, or penetrate the concrete wall with a high performance drill (or cannon shell). 

Almost offtopic: I still remember the racing games back from the Sega Genesis days which I never, ever, had to hit the brakes. You want frigates to run over the Titan and never hit the brakes?

I prefer to have some game device which can wreck a battleball into smithereens, namely the Titan. As long as there is SOMETHING which can stop it on its tracks, it's not OP. But it doesn't have to be frigates.

I agree that frigates should not be able to swarm and take down titans instantly or even quickly as they are in perspective titans that must be approached with caution and treated as such, however the kultorask is to much atm as the only effective means is mass bombers, which is no easy feat as they can have their corvettes and other ships take out your carriers whilst the titan moves in so if you try to support your carriers all will be used as snacks, so its basically a hit and run strat which if you are like me playing the AL your worst enemy will be VR, because with the phase missiles and the ability to eat your entire fleet with their titan will render my titan useless as I need my fleet to achieve maximum firepower so in my case using a titan to engage titan will fail horribly

Both VR starbase and titan need a nerf. That VR titan frigate eating ability is very OP as it is. The amount of health restored from consuming frigates should only be enough to slow down the damage rate, not actually make it invulnerable.

That's the issue here.  To beat a fleet, you need a fleet or high-level titan (or sometimes a maxed SB will suffice).  The VR have bar-none the most powerful late-game fleet in the game.  While others have to concern themselves with petty things like frigates, the Kultorask can just eat them and keep them disabled half the time.  If the VR get's bored, it can just nuke every subtitan with Dissever (because you can bet this thing'll hit level 6 unless it's opponent ragequit before then).

Basically, your defenses against a powerful fleet are going to ordinarily consist of 4 things: frigate fleet, capitals, starbase, and titan.  The problem is that the Kultorask can make itself invulnerable and completely make a chunk of your fleet worthless.  Without your frigates, the VR's frigates are going to give the VR player far more DPS.  With this advantage for the VR, they can proceed to steamroll you if they have an Orkulus Rex with them.  Unlike other starbases which probably only get to fire at 4-5 enemies at once, Debris Vortex combined with the fact that the Orky can hit more targets at will for more DPS than any other unit in the game: more than 300 DPS on each of 16 targets.  As a result, an Orkulus Rex can demolish your remaining capitals, in particular because a lot of it's DPS is in the form of PM's which just happens to be the specialty weapon of the VR.  

Now that your capitals and frigates are dead, all you have left really are your titan and starbase.  While the Orky probably lost it's shields destroying your capitals, it has Debris Vortex, remember?  By now, all your frigates are dead and all that is just food for the Orkulus Rex, meaning that it too is basically immortal and you are now facing two invincible titans and a full fleet without yours.  The next step for the VR is to press towards your starbase and any repair platforms.  Disintegrators will make quick work of them both.

This leaves only your titan if you're lucky and a few stragglers.  Honestly, the focus fire from the fleet/Orky/bombers will probably kill the titan within seconds and Ruiner mines will prevent the fleeing ships from leaving.  In other words, you just lost your entire military force.

Orkies threatened to be OP on the attack in Entrenchment and Trinity because getting one built in your gravity well meant putting out thousands of points of damage while the rest of your fleet gets wailed on by the attacking fleet or lose the gravity well.  Now you have to put out tends of thousands of points of damage against something that is sending out 300+ DPS to each target, about a third of which is PM's.

Maxed Orkies have always been the most powerful starbase.  They were the first titan.  Once maxed and escorted by a fleet, they would refuse to die.  The reason that facing Orkulus Rex+Kultorask+fleet is OP is because there's nothing that can really do anything to stop it.

Send frigates?  Nano Leech
Send capitals? Nano Leech+Orky
Hide by starbase? Orky goes to town
Send titan? Orky+bombers

The Orky fundamentally isn't more powerful than the Kultorask, but when used together and escorted, pretty much everything is doomed.

On the plus side, it gives bombers a good reason to hit the field in place of your standard mixed-frigate fleet.  Nobody uses bombers anymore.

Dude I lost a VR titan to regular base defense and a few frigates.... I guess the disruptive nanite ability on the missile platforms was buffed from diplo as it not only disabled passive regen, but also antimatter and sheild regen.... not know that little error cost me a level 2 titan cause I thought it could tank those defenses, and it probably could have but chance was not on my side that day....

As advent I have plenty of bombers as my drone hosts always have bombers late game, (i still have my halycon for fighters of course) but even then a competent player playing as VR can send in their corvettes to destroy my carriers as I said me playing as AL will be owned by VR everytime and if I am not mistaken is it not the VR that has the corvette that stops shield regen? If so thats even WORSE for me lmao

Oh, I know.  I'm sure most people do.

I just thought it was funny to suggest that the thing isn't a problem because trying to attack it with units is the 'wrong strategy'. There really doesn't seem to be a whole lot of other options, especially when the Vultorask isn't traveling alone (which it never will be unless your opponent is incompetent). 

?

Bombers are like the best thing to use against Titans and SBs...

OK but do you need 1000 fleet of bombers to mow down a Titan? Can't you combine it with anti-LF and kite away from the Titan to destroy it? 

NO NO NO we can't do that, we also can't use capital ships or other titans against it, it must be destroyed by 10s of light frigates! We also can't try to fight it on a more suitable area where maybe we have an SB positioned....

Am I doing it rite?

Anti-LF (AKA as LRF) can't "kite"...they are one of the slowest frigates in the game, and if you screw up your kiting even once you are in a world of hurt once the leaches hit it....

I remeber back in the Entranchment days vasari eco spot used to spamm orkies and kept fleet pop low.

Now vasari eco can spamm orkies and be actualy the most powerful military while having virtually no fleet.

Vasari is just so broken when comparing to other 2 races, the only time you stand a chance against vasari in MP is if he is stupid or rushed 1 jumps away by corvetes.

Late game is Vasari town hands down no questions asked.

Titans are pretty anti frigate too... I mean most titan eat through frigates...

Shotgun!!! or plain tanky tanky with twin repair station and a few static guns will eat through a lot of crap...

Or that advent rebel titan that can basically recycle your frigates...

Taking a Titan head on in it's well is pretty dumb...

Then you simply use a massive wave of fighter you always keep them at the well edge... then on your side you have a station waiting for the chasing fleet...

STRATAGA!!!

the counter to this would be a huge fleet of fighter, but then flak frigate take out fighters.... STRATAGA!!!

Not necessarily, I playing as AL in my own gravity well with repair stations, static defenses, sb, and fleet with my titan, would be owned by VR when their fleet, titan, and sb, jumped in period, a competent player would know how to take me down very quickly as a matter of fact, their sb would laugh at mass disorientation and would come in for the kill whilst he kept their support in the back his fighters and bombers will not be as numerous as mine but would be far superior as they are more heavily armored and have phase missiles so what would happen if even I set my fleet to stay near defenses they would send in sb first once I have engaged sb  then they would send the titan up to start leeching, placing my carriers on the edge of grav well would result in them getting chased down by corvettes and skirmishers so even if I had defense vessels escorting them the skirmishers would own me ending scenario would be me well dead =]

I think the OP was mentioning the Vasari SB (Orbalisk? something like that.). It has a (relatively) hard counter; various torpedo or plasma cruisers. It will kill starbases rather quickly, even if they're mobile. They will take their time against a fully upgraded starbase, but then a... quick calc here.. 17k credit investment + unknown but large amounts of metal and crystal should require something substantial to stop. 

What makes it so strong is its low supply / CP requirement, but on the other hand, there can only be one per system (active) so that will not help much in any one battle.

Now, I know the Korsul battleship is a pretty okay counter to the rebel titan - it eats antimatter, so it can't activate its specials after a (short) while but I do believe other factions has similar methods to shut it down in one way or another, if you'll only check the special abilities you don't use so much usually. 

With that said, the titan seems to be on the strong side unless you have just the right ships on hand *AND* it is unsupported. But the starbases alone should be easily manageable. (So yes, the vasari rebel scum needs more ships than just the starbase). 

The problem with static defense for other races is just that, it is static. A fully upgraded SB is huge investment, and once you lay it down, it stays there. It cant defend other wells, or assault enemy. So if enemy choses to ignore defenses, like vasari can thanks to kostura cannon, all you investment are for nothing.

Ironically, vasari have best defense and offense of all races. The nanite missiles that disable AM and passive repair is one of the few thing that can kill orky or VR titty. Phasic trap is best anti bomber defence bar none. And the best thing is that you can scatter them, as they are equally defective scattered around well or concentrated in one area. And you dont even need as many of them to get the desired effect.

In short, best thing to kill vasari is other vasari.

Now pair this with vasari late game mobility, you have a something that is just no possible to balance. Not unless  you give other races something to preform similar tasks that i mentioned above.

You counter the above by fully upgrading your valuable planets with Sbs and static defenses. Also the Kostra cannon technique does have a serious drawback, though it can be mitigated if your careful, but here is the lowdown.

If you use the kostra cannon to attack behind enemy lines then unless you brought the titan with the phase stabilizer node or have the level six merauder you are stuck unless you can capture the planet. If you fail this attempt you are trapped behind enemy lines and will have to fight your way out to get back to your world or unless you can take an enemy world and build a phase node there. And making things dicey is the fact that if you lose either the titan or the other ship your in jeopardy of being cut off and losing everything you sent there.