Anything with space in it. I plan to get it if time allows and god permits. With more to explore colonize and conquer should be a slug fest with empires going at it. A feature that would be neat would be instead of being conquered and that it you would be in a sense under that empires rule kind of a prisoner it would be a nice storyline campaign.

Its called a vassal. ala Civ4

Monc34  

Spore is another one that will probably have combat in a much smaller scale, but sounds very interesting.

WRT Frogboy's original post, GalCiv is a superb single player game, and Dark Avatar is intended to build onto that. Grafting in multiplayer isn't necessary, or, if common sentiment is any indication, even especially wanted. Tactical combat would be nice, but, as has been noted, replacing the entire combat system of a game is for a sequel, not an expansion pack.

What it can do is (believe it or not) expand existing game mechanics. And it sound like this is exactly what they're doing: espionage, colonization, and ship construction are all getting major additions. Good for Stardock for improving what's already good and not trying to make the game something it isn't.

re starbases. AIs build starbases seemingly in the middle of nowhere to extend their range.

re starbases. AIs build starbases seemingly in the middle of nowhere to extend their range

as do I, lol

re starbases. AIs build starbases seemingly in the middle of nowhere to extend their range.

wouldn't econ starbases work just as well? because using influence bases would only get the races into trouble.

wouldn't econ starbases work just as well? because using influence bases would only get the races into trouble

I use econ starbases myself -- guess the AI isn't as wimpy as I am.
Actually don't we have to add modules in order to actually have an influence starbase have an influence effect?
So unless they add influence modules, It shouldn't get them in trouble.

It seems it's more a case of what's good for the goose is not good for the gander.

They want to extend their influence, so build influence bases. But if the human player does the same thing they will have war declared on them. Econ bases do not have the same negative effect on relations as influence bases.

I think they just use it as another excuse to declare war. Even so-called "good" races will declare war whenever they feel like it. They are not more diplomatic or peace-loving in any way, and in some cases they seem more blood thirsty than the evil races.

I think that Dark Avatar does have enough new features to qualify it as an expansion, so on that count S1Genocide is wrong; however, I think he has a valid point. What he's reallying complaining about is that the facets of gameplay Dark Avatar focuses on doesn't appeal to him. The real question isn't if this is a real expansion, or does the amount of new content justify its price tag, but did the design team choose the correct aspects of game play to improve and/or extend. This comes down to a personal choice for each individual gamer, but all of those personal choices will eventually add up. Will DA resonate with its current fan base, and attract new fans? Probably. Could DA have had a better feature set? Maybe.

I can see why Brad has decided to avoid multiplayer, and as a causual MPer, it doesn't effect me that much personally. I can see why other people want MP, and are disappointed it's still not a feature. When you think of your top five list does DA match it? My personal list looks something like this...

*Greatly improved diplomacy

*Improved domestic politics (something similar to Civics in Civ4 or Social Engineering in SMAC, but better than either of those two systems)

*More ship components (cloaking devices, fire control, repair bays, carriers, etc)

*Heros/Captains/Admirals/Generals/Govenors/Great People

*Better spy system

I'm cautiously optimistic about the new ship parts, I'm excited about the new spy system (though worried it will be very difficult to make it fun, give it strategic depth, and keep it balanced), but the rest of DA's features (except for the AI) doesn't appeal to me. Not that I think they'll hurt gameplay or anything. I just had other priorities for what I wanted in an expansion.

One comment about Civ3:PtW. Although it did add multiplayer, this was a feature that was supposed to be in Civ3, but was eventually cut so the game could ship. Only months before Civ3 came out Firaxis was making vague promises about the multiplayer in Civ3, then the game shipped without multiplayer. All in all Civ3 was a disappointment, and it seemed like it had a busted development cycle. Fortunantly Civ4, more than made up for civ3!

And multiplayer is already in the coding just a few bugs to work around like what happens when 4 ships attack the same spot?

Wow, really? Damb, that should make a few people happy... can you give us any info on what type of multiplayer...?

I think that DA will add more than enough to justify its existence. Hostile environments will radically alter how the early game plays out, we will have to decide more carefully which planets to go for and it may even remove some early competition between some races as they won't be able to use the same world types to begin with.

The espionage system and asteroid mining both open up new branches of strategic options. Then you get what I consider extras like new ship jewelry, even more AI tweaks and even some graphical improvements. Thats an impressive and meaningful feature list.

The original quote throws all of that aside as two features aren't included. Multiplayer and Tactical combat. MP is an expansion pack all on its own, anything else that comes with it will be small scale things such as ship jewelry - quick turn around stuff with little coding.

Tactical combat would be the greatest expansion ever made. Many sequels don't add such ambitious new content. Theres a massive amount of work involved in pulling that off and making it work well. And to be honest I don't really want it all that much, it would make GC2 into something very different.

p.s. I have a small question.. I shall repeat again.... the one thing that drives me nuts is when the AI builds influence starbases in the middle of my territory far away from everything, and what I want to know is the AI trying to overtly force a war with me? (at this point we are usually allied).

They're probably trying to prevent you from winning a culture victory. If not they are either trying to gain a culture victory themselves or just to flip your planets. Just because they're talking friendly it doesn't mean they don't want to be the galaxies most powerful race - they just dont want to fight your fleets.

Well, I'm not so sure. SimCity was very popular, and SimGalacticEmpire might be too! Seriously though, there are many of us who get off on building. Another example might be Society. It sounds like combat will be a VERY small part of that game. -Cauldyth

Hmmm a mod where all the weapon and defence techs cost 10x the normal RPs might be interesting

wouldn't econ starbases work just as well? because using influence bases would only get the races into trouble.

I always use military bases as range extenders

(Citizen)V1mSeptember 7, 2006 09:20:50Reply #62And multiplayer is already in the coding just a few bugs to work around like what happens when 4 ships attack the same spot? Wow, really? Damb, that should make a few people happy... can you give us any info on what type of multiplayer...?

Back in beta stardock put in the 'plumbing' for multiplayer with the intention of someday adding multiplayer functions. Believe it or not but Frogboy is actually quite a fan of multiplayer TBS games himself, when work on GC2 was still in its early days he posted a journal somewhere saying that he wanted to do multiplayer but knew that he was in the minority who would use it.

The fact that an MP expansion is now looking like a real possibility is interesting, perhaps the unexpectedly good sales of GC2 have made it more of a reasonable financial venture. The number of player wanting a TBS MP game is a relatively small percentage, but at least now theres a much larger number of people in that niche. 15% of 100 gets you 15 customers, 15% of 1000 gets you 150 customers.

I agree with the approach, Dark avatar serves the largest number of the customer base with singleplayer content, once thats done you can look at doing the rest. By then hopefully even more people will have bought GC2 and the MP mode benefits from the extra DA content too. Bigger fan base = more online opponents once the multiplayer finally does land..

Ultimately, sales of Dark Avatar will determine what the GalCiv II team works on next. Either more GalCiv II stuff or other projects.  I think the feature set of GalCiv II Dark Avatar is compelling enough that it will do pretty well.

So, extending ship range through influence starbases.. not very smart. The AI loses it's mind when I build an influence starbase anywhere near a border. I build economic starbases to extend range, or try to take resources early on.

This is one thign that doesn need addressing, if only to reduce the amount of needless wars.

So, extending ship range through influence starbases.. not very smart. The AI loses it's mind when I build an influence starbase anywhere near a border. I build economic starbases to extend range, or try to take resources early on. This is one thign that doesn need addressing, if only to reduce the amount of needless wars.

I disagree, if the AI ignored your influence starbases it would make culture wins very very easy.

Although if there are alot of wars going on in the galaxy, the infliuence bases tend to have a short lifespan and so don't become a problem.

It's also annoying when they place alot of econ starbases around my homeworld since I always have all of my trade routes origionate from my homeworld.

Any chance of Dynamic Game Difficulty Level in Dark Avatar?

I am looking forward to the next expansion.

Any chance for the following?

Ground combat:

1. Updating the visuals/graphics to reflect soldiering bonus and levels. When research allows a new tech that creates better soldiering capabilities, it would be great if the appearances of the troops would change. Especially if you get a unique tech such as Tir Quan training, it would be nice to have some visual (bling reflective of your alignment, maybe a cool banner carried by the troops) that shows that soldiers are getting tougher or if the enemy has it you can see that in the fights.
2. Is it possible to updating the visuals/graphics so that each race has a more distinctive race look for their soldiers?
3. At the beginning when you are in the set up, would it be possible to select your troop’s appearance, along the lines of when you choose your race colours for your ships. Maybe with several choices for troop types?
4. The ability to mod your soldiers would be cool
5. Adding of special units graphics to the attack i.e. tanks, battle mechs, space marines, fighters as they become available. To liven up the battles

Planets:

1. Alien civilization specific buildings
2. That each Civ has its own look for buildings i.e. manufacturing centres for each race are different but do the same thing.
3. That your buildings reflect your alignment and empires political party leaning.
4 That when you capture a planet with another Civ’s buildings that they remain that style unless you demolish or they gradually blend?
5. That there be some sort of graphic visual that shows what beings live on the planet i.e. if a planet surrenders you see that Civ’s race on the planet in the population counter
6. That there might be a history created for the planet i.e. telling you when colonized, that the planet was captured by the empire of whoever at a loss of 5 billion per’s, that secret police or information centres have capture or turned x number of dissidents, that this planet found an alien precursor mine by explorers, that spies destroyed x during the year etc..
7. That planets when attacked by certain types of weapons actual change looks with craters or floods, volcano’s after the attacks
8. That the number of new planet types being added show new graphics?
9. As the planet tiles fill up, that there be some sort of growth appearing like roads connecting the tiles and small buildings start to appear. Possibly reflecting your ethos lots of parks or industrial unit’s maybe militaristic style for imperial empires etc...

Keep up the great work! Game rocks

Although I'm not looking forward to more "d00d where's teh MP/??!?!?! omg lame" posts.

LOL, I like reading the posts those idiots write, crack me up.  

Also really looking forward to Dark Avatar, as always great work Stardock.  

There is always a lot of hyperbole whenever an expansion comes out. The developers always claim that it is 'more like a sequel than an expansion', and this is inevitably an overstatement. Likewise, unless the expansion is a real shocker (Civ3:PTW) it will usually be above what modders could achieve. The only exception to this I've seen is Civ4, where the incredible modability means there genuinely are mods out there which play more like sequels. It is a shame Galciv2 has nowhere near this level of modability.

As to DA, I would echo what (Citizen)korn469 said earlier. The planned features look promising certainly, but with the notable exception of spying, not really the areas most in need of an overhaul. I know everyone has their little pet projects they wish could be included (my own being Heroes), but the game doesn't lose out from not having these. Certain other features though, such as the rather limited diplomacy, and real lack of an internal politics/civics system of any substance, are issues which seem to crop up repeatedly on the forums, yet don't seem to be forthcoming in the expansion.

1. Alien civilization specific buildings 2. That each Civ has its own look for buildings i.e. manufacturing centres for each race are different but do the same thing. 3. That your buildings reflect your alignment and empires political party leaning. 4 That when you capture a planet with another Civ’s buildings that they remain that style unless you demolish or they gradually blend?

This was a hot topic back in beta and something nearly everyone wanted, so Frogboy supplied some number on why it wasn't going to happen.

Consider that you have several types of building (farm, factory, research lab, economic, defence, trade goods, super projects, capitals). Each of those has multiple upgrade versions (basic factory, xeno factory, advanced factory etc).

There are 10 races in the game(12 with DA right?) plus the minors. Lets assume the minors use a major races style. Add up all the different types of structure, and all the upgrade versions for each one. Multiply by 12 (one style per race). You are looking at one helluva lot of buildings.

Frogboy worked out that it would take 1 artist a full working year to get all the artwork done! That's alot of man hours for a cosmetic nicety, so unfortunately, it aint gonna happen.