anyone up for a game later

Just thought I'd repost this since I didn't get any feedback, and I'm curious to see what people think about it.

I agree about the Defiant

If anything, it should be considered a "heavy cruiser"

Offset it's power and speed with a high supply, longer build time, highest and most expensive research tier.

Assuming the Defiant was a quick fix for the borg problem, then I think it should be expensive to research and build

the basic compass directions as you call it an easy way to work out your fire arcs (If you are thinking in terms of 2D, 2D battles like Vanilla SoASE). However SoA 2 is more 3D so you need to think in 3D.   

each fire arc is + and - 90 degrees from the direction the null arrow point is facing (in terms of both 2D and 3D). However you can of course have your Null Arrow points facing in any direction you wish it is fully 3d Have them Forward but angle them up by 45 degrees for the top of the ship and Forward and angle them down by 90 degrees etc etc if you want it is for you to decide untill you think its right mystic

try to imagine half a sphere around the null point and that gives you your weapon arc that is what i do in XSI when working out the arcs for ships and stations. (It got very god dam complicated on the borg starbase trying to make it so they dont shoot through the station, yet still give it a full 360 degree (3D) fire arc )

sorry for bad english i am somewhat drunk

It just seems that a big ship like the Akira is more suited for the Cap Ship Slot than the Cruiser Slot. 

Really, having the Defiant as a mean little Cruiser Killer compliments the Capital Ships very well.  I remember a discussion about different types of weapons and damage, where the classification of a weapon's type effected damage to a particular kind of ship. 

The biggest thing I see here is people are afraid to gimp the Defiant, or make it a god ship. 

If you place it in the Cruiser pool at the top with plenty of cost and upkeep, equip it with anti-cruiser weapons, and a nasty set of teeth, it still turns into the "tough little ship" we all know and love it for.  Its a good counter to the bulk of an enemy force as cruisers make up large portions of any developed fleet, and the upkeep could be so that it can't easily be spammed and abused, but low enough that you get what you pay for.

And once you do that, you leave the Akira to fill the Carrier Cap role where it can really shine.

To me, its a win, win.

Hi everybody,

I just downloaded this mod and i'm loving it. I was wondering though if anyone knows if the ship sizes were finalized. It just seems like there should be a bigger difference in the sizes of capital ship and crusiers. I was not sure if there sizes were so close for a reason. Also it seems like using the dynamic fighter style flying in battle is hindered alittle in the visuals because the ships can get so close together they end up bumping into each other. Is there anyway to limit how close they can get? Also it might look alittle better if the bigger ships (capital) weren't using the dynamic fighter style flying. It seems thay should be less manuverable or at least a lot slower when they "bob and weave". Just my thoughts thank you for any comments.

Problem is its a lose lose situation, and i'm gonna tell you why. Both of these ships were created to combat the borg. Each of them are OP by their own standard. you have a ship that could literally destroy of disable a small fleet of its own and you have a small ship with enough firepower and defenses  so lets break it down.

Defiant:
4 x pulse fire disruptors (pulse phasers in some places)
1 x Aft phaser array.
2 x Fwd quantum torpedo launcher
1 x Aft photon launcher
damage output 60,000 terawatts

now lets do the math.
5 weapons = 12000 terawatts each
4 pulse are doing 48000 terawatts per shot, usually fires in rapid succession of 3-5 shots

Akira:
5 x Phaser Arrays (270 degree coverage)*
15 x Photon Torpedo Tubes (Pulse Fire Tubes)*1
damage output 22,500 terawatts

now lets do the math.
1 x Large Saucer Array (Dorsal) 11,250 Terawatts
2 x Medium Saucer Arrays (Ventral) 2812.5 Terawatts
2 x Small Lateral Arrays 1406.25 Terawatts

Now in theory how emitter arrays are explained, the more emitters on the array, the more powerful the phaser is suppose to be.

(*) Currently it is disputed that the akira actually has 7 phaser arrays. the offical canon spec states 5, the model contains 7, the other 2 small arrays are located on the aft end of each nacelle

(*1) pulse fire tubes fire at a rate of 4 torpedoes/sec with a 1 sec reload. 350 torpedo compliment. 5 volleys total.

Notice that i did not mention what the power output of the quantums and the photons are suppose to be becuase no where in any canon spec do they reveal what the actual yield is per torp! there is no canon spec.

if there is any ship which is really underpowered it is the vorcha. the vorcha's output is 60,000 terawatts she is suppose to be on par with the galaxy. the galazy has 11 phasers compared to the vorcha's 12.   

http://www.st-minutiae.com/academy/engineering102A/starfleet_1.png

http://www.st-minutiae.com/academy/engineering102A/starfleet_2.png

in case you were wondering what they should be

Thank you darkshimmer for those links. I'm guessing that since you have that information you did all the calculations on how big they should be in the game. It's a great mod so far and i'm sure it's going to be even better. Good job to the whole team.

I have to agree with Ryugi on the defiant matter. In-game, the the Defiant at it's current level of attack and defense is far weaker than the other capital ships. I had a fleet full of defiants that didnt fare too well against a fairly large enemy fleet, while another of my fleets being half that size with Galaxy-Class and Sovvies took out another enemy fleet of similar size and strength. Not to mention that one-on-one the Defiant just doesnt do enough to keep up with other capital ships of Fed or Klink design. Not to mention it's size just totally throws off the looks of my fleet

If we kept the Defiant at it's same stats and swapped it with the Akira being made slightly (meaning just enough to par it up with other caps of the line) stronger and having abilities like a torpedo barrage to boot, then we got ourselves a serious ball game.

Not to say that i disagree with keeping it canon though. I'm always a fan of canon, but in this case i don't think it has as much use as making the game playable.

That aside, i absolutely love this mod now that i get starbases and decent defenses . Great job on a work well done so far, and i cannot wait to kill some rommies and soon after that i hope to kill some dominion fleets! But i won't be killing the borg. Ever. I'll be playing as them .

The Defiant, an itty bitty little frigate, survived a sustained battle with a full blown cube that wiped out most of the fleet sent to stop it, including the admiral's flagship.  The Defiant is thus one tough mother fucker.  Failed in fighting the Borg, or they just under-estimated them and sent too small a fleet?  Try to stay realistic while forming your arguments.

As far as the Akira goes, theoretically torpedoes are much less effective against shields.  An explosive device would be doing a fraction of the damage to a shield that it was to hulls, as they'd be designed to penetrate before exploding.  The maximum would be half as the torpedoes have not been shown to be a shaped explosive.  If they could penentrate the shield in the same manner as the hull, most of the blast would simply be in the space inbetween the bubble and the hull, and outside, with almost nothing being absorbed by it.  It's not really that dangerous a ship, or the dominion war would have been a walk in the park with just a few of them wiping out entire fleets in seconds.  The people behind the show could have just been utter morons though.

How one translates that to the game, and if one should even try considering we don't have numbers for either...

I'd say its more realistic that they sent every ship available to deal with the situation.  You'd have to be stupid to underestimate the Borg.  The truth is, we don't know how long the ships were attacking the cube, so saying it was a "sustained" battle may be pushing it.  Did the Borg attack the Defiant constantly?  Probably not.  We can't say for sure, because the movie doesn't tell us.  We don't know the time delay between the battle starting and the Enterprise arriving on the scene.  But really, that shouldn't be a factor.  The Defiant Class just isn't a Capital Ship. 

Is it a pushover?  Hell no, its a tough ship. 

But it is not a Capital Ship.