Who's in charge, the parent or child?

Kids have too much these days!

from JoeUser Forums
I just had to write about this because it is in my face every day. Too many parents let their kids walk all over them these days! A prime example is played out in a commercial that irks me every time I see it. It is the one about which is more frustrating, sharing a phone with a teen or dealing with dial up. Whenever the snotty teen says, "I'm on the phone!" I think, that parent should say, "Are you paying the phone bill? Until you do, you will use the phone when I say you can."

How is it that parents now let kids think that they have the right to TELL them where they will be, what they will be doing, wearing, etc. I think the fine art of tough love has been lost. I hear people debating with 5yr olds...come on! I remember threatening my Mom that if I didn't get my way I would run away. Did she debate? No. She said, "Here's a lunch. Take care." She new I would go as far as my neighbor's house, sulk and then want to come home. That would probably be considered child abuse these days. It got the message through to me that I wasn't the only one in the family that mattered. I had to consider others.

I fear we are raising a generation of selfish, greedy, disrespectful, inconsiderate people. Even my son's kindergarten teacher let the students walk all over her (almost literally!) I am not a strict person by any means but my kids, even at this early age are getting lessons in the fact that it is Mommy and Daddy's house they live in. They live by our rules. We stand by the old motto that you get to be boss once you have your own house.

I know that teens are difficult. I don't really look forward to those days but I do remember what it was like. I think the kids that have more structure and more limits have an easier time than the ones that have more percieved freedom. They do better with parents that are parents not ones that try to be their buddy. I don't strive to be the "cool" mom. I strive to be the mom that has well adjusted, well behaved kids that become good contributions to society.
5,966 views 26 replies
Reply #1 from JoeUser Forums Top
I agree wholeheartedly
Reply #2 from JoeUser Forums Top
You know I've been reading a lot. Between Dr Spock and Anthony E Wolf, I think I may be learning how to be a better parent. I went from a single mom with 1 child to a married mom with 4 kids. As my husband and I were both single parents we both found it hard to be the rock and the punisher. It's so hard to be emotionally supportive and the structured warden when you don't have anyone around to help.

The largest problem I'm running into now is a 4, and a 3 yr old who both think they run the house. "Daddy lets me do this..." and so on and so forth. It's hard to break that down, and rebuild their lifestructure. More often than not I find that they really are in charge, because he backs down way too often when it comes to punishments. I spent all day packing up all of their toys and putting them away because they wouldn't go to bed- they'd play in their room all night then expect to sleep all day long.

Anyways, didn't mean to write a novel. Maybe it's harder for two families to mix together and make it successful.
Elemental: Reforged
Reply #3 from JoeUser Forums Top
I think for any kind of parenting, if the parents don't present a united front, you will cause more harm than good. I found that out the hard way. I was/am the softy. I would disagree with my husband right in front of the kids...very bad idea. The kids will quickly learn to try to use that. Now, I back him up whether I agree or not. We then discuss it without the kids around. YOu can always make adjustments afterward.

Don't let guilt or anything else fog your better judgement. The kids will be better off I guarantee.
Reply #4 from JoeUser Forums Top
Yes! Jill, you have hit it on the head. The whole "Go ask your mom/go ask your dad" thing. When our first child was still too young to be disciplined (< 1 ) my wife and I came to an agreement that neither of us would nullify what the other one says or does in front of the kids, just for the sheer fact that kids know how to use that against their parents.

I too see too many kids these days who have parents that are way too soft on them. One time a woman in the store looked at me funny because I smacked my oldest son on the ass for running in the store and hiding from me. I basically told him that it was very dangerous for him to run and hide and that I almost called the police because I couldn't find him (after I swatted him). The woman looked aghast that I would actually smack my child in public. Seeing her reaction I asked her if she had a problem with the way I disciplined my child, upon which she turned around and fled with her cart. Now, I am by no means a complete Nazi with my kids (because I was a boy, I know about all of the dumb things that they're going to do when they're growing up), but I'll be damned if I'm going to raise my children to be a couple of hooligans with no respect or manners.

I would like to note though, that my kids are generally well behaved, and they do take the occasional liberty to try and step over the line once in a while. I think that's healthy for kids, but they've got to learn why it's important to be well-behaved individuals for the sake of others.
Reply #5 from JoeUser Forums Top
So true. The sad thing is that it's not hard on them untill they are used to it and enter this thing called the real world and then have a hard time because they all ways want it their way (as opposed to giving in for once or compromising) and their boss couldn't care less.
Reply #6 from JoeUser Forums Top
People act like you are abusing your kid if you even yell at them for anything. Gee, what is better- yell at your kid, or let them get their hand slammed in a door? Yell at your kid, or let them get bitten by the dog because they keep pulling the dog's hair out?

I don't believe in hitting, but my daughter has gotten a slap on the bum a couple times. That only happens if she does something *so* bad that you never want her to do it again.

I *really* don't want my daughter to grow up being a snotty little jerk. She would be that way, however, if I followed the "new" way of raising children.
Reply #7 from JoeUser Forums Top
I do believe in spanking when it is for something that is dangerous for the child (like running away from you) or if you just can't get their attention any other way. Sometimes that is what it takes. It is effective too. I got spanked growing up. Only a couple of times. I am not a violent person. I don't believe in taking anger out physically.

People who think that kids are physical because they got spanked are foolish. Kids that get beaten are a different subject. A couple of the kids that I have seen do more of the hitting, pushing and kicking are from families that don't believe in spanking. I often feel those kids need to be pushed, kicked or hit back so they can realize what they are doing. I do know, from experience, that if a child pulls hair, the best way to get them to stop is to pull theirs and say "do you like that?" That is probably considered child abuse these days.

Learning empathy and respect is very important. The "kids have to come first" generation is doing the kids and themselves a disservice. Kids shouldn't be raised to think that everything is for and about them. They need to learn the differences between Need and Want and Rights and Priveleges.
Reply #9 from JoeUser Forums Top
my parents were fairly strict on me and if I stepped out of line I was either grounded, lost privaleges (no TV or worse...no books. Sounds funny but true) and more than a few times spanked. I hated them when they did it, know what I think now? It should be done more often. Going through public education not too long ago, I would never have blamed a teacher if they came up and walloped some of those kids.

I still wouldnt
Reply #10 from JoeUser Forums Top
yeah, i agree, i mean, my parents keep me in line and i listen to them, but other families, like when i go to the mall, i see even 8 year olds bossing their parents around and the parents have no choice but to listen to them because if not, the child starts screaming and draws attention. no offense, and i know that i am far from being a parent, but i think that the reason for this is because the parents raise their kids to think that the universe revolves around them. the parents ask the kids if they would like to eat, or if they would like to go to school; my parents are like "put on your shoes, your going to school" or "sit down, eat and dont whine about the stuff on your plate" and i grew up to be good, and most important, i listen to my parents and respect them.i guess my parents were kinda like Chris' and i acted the same way as he did, i despised my parents for that but now, i love them and i see why they did it.
Reply #13 from JoeUser Forums Top
I totally understand where you're coming from, though I'm only 17. I work at a taekwondo school, and we get, by and large, kids whose parents can't handle them. I'm talking about the kids who try to hit their parents, threaten classmates and teachers, and some who have been to juvee. And most of these kids are under 12 years old! I'm wondering why parents can't follow through with punishments, or even (heaven forbid!) backhand the kid if he/she really mouths off. My mom employed tough love on me, and I hated it, but it sure taught me to mind my pleases and thank yous.
By the way, thanks for writing this article, hopefully it'll make a difference. Kids today...
Reply #15 from JoeUser Forums Top
It's considered child abuse to discipline a child. I'm not out of my twenties, but I was taught to respect my parents. If I broke the rules laid out, I got spanked. I think there were a few times I should have gotten more of a punishment than I did. Now it's, "You made your child cry! GO TO JAIL, DO NOT PASS GO, DO NOT COLLECT 200 DOLLARS!" I know things are in place to prevent the kind of child abuse we all cringe at the thought of, but just for looking at your kid wrong, you stand the risk of someone calling you into social services.

Give a child power, they become a Tyrant.
Things cannot stay this way.
Reply #16 from JoeUser Forums Top
"You made your child cry! GO TO JAIL, DO NOT PASS GO, DO NOT COLLECT 200 DOLLARS!"


hahahahaha good one.
Reply #17 from JoeUser Forums Top
i agree with webmastah all the way, seeing as that WAS my login before... ;)
Reply #18 from JoeUser Forums Top
Thing is, kids tend to be rebellious because they were raised by telling them what's right and wrong; sometimes backing it up with punishment and reward, but RARELY explained with enough comprehensiveness as to WHY some things are right, and some things are wrong.

Not to piss on your parade or anything, but would you really wanna raise your kids in a way that they'd look forward to the day when they're out of your house, and NOT adopt your way of parenting? ;)

Of course there are the extreme cases where you'd really have to push back, when they're pushing you to your limits...
Reply #19 from JoeUser Forums Top
Don't mean to piss on your parade but some of the most well adjusted, successful people I know had parents that were parents not buddy's. Lived by rules and knew who the boss was (meaning they respected their parents). If having my kids turn out successful and well adjusted requires them to "look forward to the day when they're out" then so be it. Matter of fact, it is more of a healthy progression for kids to want to leave their parents home. I love my kids but don't want them to live with me forever. I want them to make it on their own.

I don't know where you concluded from my article that people not explain right and wrong to their kids. Kids are often rebellious because that is the nature of the beast. They push the envelope to see how far they can get. If they see there is no boundary, they will keep pushing. When there are sound boundaries set, they move on.
Reply #20 from JoeUser Forums Top
There's a significant difference between being successful in life fiscally, and being able to find true happiness. Oftentimes kids grow up being pushed into narcissism and/or other personal disorders due to unbalanced parental discipline.

Sorry if I failed to clarify between looking forward to leaving-- out of desire for independence, or simply to escape.

Furthermore, it's self-contradictory to apply the same reasoning to conclude "nature of the beast" and "well-adjusted". Maybe they give off the impression that they're well adjusted after punishment, but how do you know for sure if they're not just repressed?

Admittedly, I never got info enough from your article alone to formulate a substantial conclusion. I was merely pointing out some things on child/teenage rebellion...

Kids are often rebellious and explore radical alternatives because they have yet to see the big picture and understand the idea of harmony with other peoples' feelings. Many normal and even influential grownups still have the same shortcomings, but to a more reasonably tolerable extent. No one's perfect after all. :)

Pushing boundaries as the "nature of the beast" applies only to teens suffering from the likes of Antisocial Personality Disorder and/or Borderline Personality Disorder-- a few of several covertly chronic issues that occur in teens and young adults more often than you'd think. The stress of coping with sudden lifestyle and hormone level changes vastly increase the risk of said maladaptions.

If they move on from learned boundaries without being pushy in other aspects, then that's cool. =)
Reply #21 from JoeUser Forums Top
I think most parents just give in to shut their kids up because the parent just wants to be irresponsible(and maybe not even intentionally) and will do what it takes to halt any kind of confrontation.

Well our generations is extremely screwed up too so the "I pay the bills" doesn't work either it just creates the 60's type non-directional rebellion. We need to let our kids know that they are valued members of the family and their concerns, rebuttal and input is very important. I came from a family where you did as you were told or you got your ass whipped. Well I turned out rebellious, unaccountable and generally confused. Perhaps this is because I had no fear.

I do agree the line between being stomped on by your kids and getting your point across is a very blurry one indeed. Since my boy gets straight A's and is kind, compassionate, humorous and helpful tells me I have done something right. I have friends whose kids tell them when and what they will be doing and screw you if you don't like it. At this point I think only corpreal punishment works because it has gone on too long. A good parent has to use Fear and Love in such a way as to bring the child up right without creating phobias and mental introversions later on in life. Damn I wish they came with a book LOL
Reply #22 from JoeUser Forums Top
You really do need a book for each one. Each child needs to be approached with their own individual methods of discipline. What worked with your first child might not with your second. Some kids have a natural sense of emapathy and responsibility. Others have to have everything demonstrated. I am speeking currently from being the parent of 7 and 3yr olds.

Denniskaira, I don't know if you are a parent but I am assuming you were/are a teenager. You are saying that the only teens that push their boundaries have some sort of abnormal issues?! I beg to differ. I don't know of a single person I have come into contact that has not done something rebellious as a teen. It is all part of discovering who you are.

I don't know what your credentials are. My experience comes from having been a teen, growing up closely with 17 cousins of varying ages, studying secondary ed in college (which included many courses in child development and psycology) and being a parent. I also have close friends that are teachers of both elementary and middle schools. My circle of friends consists of parents with children aging from newborn to college and everywhere in between.

I believe in communicating with your children. I believe in treating them with respect but teaching them to do the same. I believe that kids need to know how hard their parents work for them to have the things they have. Parents should be able to say "no" and have it be taken as "no". I treat my kids with love and respect. I am their parent though. I will not treat them as an equal when they are teens because they won't be.

As for the commercial that was the inspiration for my blog, I feel sorry for both the father and teen. He isn't demanding the respect that a parent should and the teen has been given an unrealistic idea of how the real world works. I had many friends in my early years of college that grew up with parents that let them walk all over them and they pretty much had breakdowns when things weren't going their way in the dorm with their roommates.
Reply #23 from JoeUser Forums Top
Ok. So, teens and just really children are bad now? That's sad to hear. I'm 16 as of right now and I had the parents who gave me "freedom". Of course I probably didn't turn out as bad as I could have because I still fear my parents nonetheless. I understand what you're saying but could I plaese ask you to take a look at a recent article of mine? It's about how I feel about teen life these days. I don't know if you'll agree with me on anything I say but I think it would really be worth your time. I'm actually almost proud of the article. You know as a teen I don't have all the answers and I don't really have too much experience but I know what I know and I know my peers and myself in the year 2003.
I can't remember the name of the article but it says in the sub title "or at least why..." something a long those lines. I don't know why I can't remember but maybe if you read it you will of a little more updated look at being a teen. Not to be offensive but I really, really think you should slow downand think about how good the children are too.
All I saw in your article was the bad. I have an 8 year old sister , one year old nephew, 4 year old nephew, 3 year old neice and a 1 year old neice. I think even though I"m not a mom or dad I know somethings about children. I was in the delivery room when my 1 year old nephew was born just so that I could see the pain my sister went through and I see him almost everyday. I have my little sister who I love more than you could possibly imagine. As I was trying to say before. I know that everytime I look at these kids I just wishI could be there with them all the time so that I could protect them and maybe even teach them. My sister comes who from school talking about atoms and cells which are things I didn't even know existed until I think it was 6th grade. All I can really say is, though there are many downsides to the way kids, including myself, behave and are brought up that the inocents of little children is greater without a doubt than the bad things they may/will do.
Still, I totally understand what you're saying and that's great that you have a full family and all but even when we go the wrong way all kids want to feel they have their parents to fall back on to say they are sorry and they still love them regardless of how big a problem the kids have caused. I know and I am so glad that my parents were there for me and support me still.
Maybe this will help a little to let you see what can happen when you just truly love and try to protect your kids. I am going attending three different schools. One is just my home high school. One is a high school with a great technical program (architecture) in it. The last is an internet school. I basically have school as a work day. I wake up at 5 in the morning to leave the house at 6:30 heading towards the technical shool wich is about 45 minutes away. Then I go to my home school until then end of the school day at 3. So I've already been up for 10 hours by the time schools out. I'm not done though. I take about 1-2 hours on a regular basis to do my homework and then start the internet program which i am usually not done with until about 7 o'clock. Yeah, it's hard but so fun that you probably can't believe it.
I sorry, I keep on going on and on. Ok, so what I was trying to say was I'd like you to look at my article. If you go to my page on cornbread.joeuser.com you can find what I was talking about. Thank you.
Capt. over and out!
Reply #24 from JoeUser Forums Top
I agree with your sentiment completely!! I have three children--almost 18, almost 14, and 11--and they know without a doubt that the final say on what they do, who they are with, when they have to be home, etc., is Mom's. They don't have to like it, they just have to abide by it.

When they were younger, they all tried the "running away" line a few times. After realizing my response would always be "Should I help you pack?" they eventually gave it up. Same with threats to call Childrens Services on me (for such "awful" things as making them brush their hair or clean their room)...I'd pick up the phone and ask "Need me to dial that number for you?"

You mention not striving to be the cool mom....I never strived for that, either, but kids all tell me that I have that title among their friends, because I allow the friends to come here, to stay overnght, to just hang out, etc., and because I talk to their friends and make the effort to get to know them and don't just treat them like "a bunch of kids." Little do they know I do that for my own reasons....I WANT to know the people my children are associating with, to feel sure they are making good choices in friends, and not being influenced in a direction where I don't want them to go. Then, once I get to know these kids, since I already feel I can trust my own--unless and until they show me otherwise, which has happened on occasion, resulting in the reins tightening HARD--then I can relax a little and send them out into the world with the group. So far, so good...none of them has gotten into any sort of trouble at school (other than for things like talking to much, which they come by naturally!) or in the community, they are all good students, they are well behaved, caring people who look out for others....I'm very proud of all of them!!! :)
Reply #25 from JoeUser Forums Top
I don't know where you concluded from my article that people not explain right and wrong to their kids. Kids are often rebellious because that is the nature of the beast. They push the envelope to see how far they can get. If they see there is no boundary, they will keep pushing. When there are sound boundaries set, they move on.

I SO agree with you here! From the time my children were little, and even as they have gotten older, we have talked about what is right and what is wrong, and why....rules aren't just set down because I want them to be, they are there for a reason. And yes, all kids will test the boundaries, but if the boundaries stay firm, they learn to live within them and accept them.