Two concerns following May update

from StarControl Forums

Hi Frogboy,

I loved the May update! The game is looking better and better with each update.

I wanted to voice two concerns that have been growing for a while:

  1. The use of SC1&2 aliens
  2. Game complexity

 

The use of SC1&2 aliens

I know you have legal issues that force your hand and compel you to add them in, to strengthen your claim to the IP, rights, etc.
I am OK with that.

But, as I see it you have two target markets:

  1. People like me who played the original game when it came out (and casually play it ever since) ("Type1")
  2. People who never played the game before ("Type2")

Type1, in my opinion, will initially say: "cool, they brought X back", but it won't be the same.
What I mean is, that in SC3 they changed the Arilou from green to pink and made them look like giant babies.
They didn't sound the same, they didn't look the same, everything was wrong... it was awful.
Your Arilou will also be different and it will clash with my "fond  childhood memories" and you will lose.
It won't be the same. You don't mess with nostalgia.

Type2 don't care, they have no reference...

My advice is to use them a sparingly as possible to solidify your legal claims.

 

Game complexity

I am a huge fan of Stardock I am a founder of SCO (obviously) and GalCiv3.
I also own copies of GalCiv1 & 2 and Sins (most of the DLCs).

I recognized a pattern in the games that I don't like...

The business model of today's gaming industries is DLC.
I am OK with that.

But, to sell a DLC you need new content.
So, in both Sins and GalCiv3 each DLC brought new game play abilities adding complexities to the original game.

For example, in Sins you introduced diplomacy.
For the life of me, I could not understand how to make alliances.
If before you needed to complete 2~3 assignments, now you needed to meet 5~6 criteria.

In GalCiv3 you added Citizens, why do I need them? it made no sense to me... Upgrade a citizen? Generals?
It added complexities and handicaps to a perfectly good game.

I stopped playing both games because they:

  1. Weren't the games I bought (they changed)
  2. Too complex for a casual player that doesn't want to learn complex game mechanics

To the point, we can see in May update that the Fleet battles in addition to the shrinking arena (new feature), worm holes (new feature) and storms (new feature), you added scavenging and who knows what else...

So, now I am thinking: "what will they do next? will each DLC change the game and make it harder to play and more obscure?"

What I hope is that the DLC will be real new content in the form of new stories, new characters, new places to visit, etc. and not a change in game play mechanics.
Why? Because I believe that you should be able to understand the mechanics of the game within 10~15 minutes (brief tutorial) and it is OK that after that it will take years to master. And more importantly, if I am used to something, why change it (unless people complained)?

 

I would really appreciate your take on this.

 

Thanks,
JohnyK

193 views 5 replies
Reply #1 from StarControl Forums Top


To the point, we can see in May update that the Fleet battles in addition to the shrinking arena (new feature), worm holes (new feature) and storms (new feature), you added scavenging and who knows what else...

 

I think a simple approach to this (much like in other fighting games like SSB) is to allow the player beforehand to place checkmarks next to the battle elements they'd like to be part of their arena. You don't want scavenging, just don't click it. You want wormholes, put a checkmark next to it. Simple and easy to modify to each player's interests.

Reply #2 from StarControl Forums Top

Great feedback.

Re Aliens

Now, with regards to the aliens, I think the story has to justify it.

My issue with the Arilou in Star Control 3 was that they violate the entire purpose of the Arilou.  The Arilou were supposed to be little green men.  They were the "visitors" trope.  And yet in SC3 they changed them.

The Arilou in Star Control: Origins also follow the visitor trope.

I.e.

http://www.thinkaboutit-aliens.com/5-alien-species-constantly-visiting-earth/

This kind of thing (note that's not what our Arilou look like).  But they are little green, telepathic, aliens who have been keeping an eye on us for a very long time and are important to the story. 

We could have called them something like Gulons or whatever as well and it would have been the same trope but when I type Star Control aliens on Google it doesn't make sense to have a new species that replicates the Arilou role when they are, obviously, a Star Control alien.  

Re Complexity

Star Control is an RPG.  It will be expanded via lore, new stories, new destinations, etc.  I think it would be a mistake for Stardock to try to make it into some sort of strategy-hybrid.  It's an RPG. Period.  You are Captain Kirk in command of your Enterprise seeking new life forms and new civilizations and so on.  And the depth is how your actions can change the universe.  It's about you and your crew.

So in short, I 100% agree with you.

 

Groupy 2 - Organize multiple applications into grouped tabs on your Windows desktop
Reply #3 from StarControl Forums Top

Very good to hear!
I am really excited by the game's beta so far.
Can't wait for the full game.

 

Giving us a chance to give feedback that actually matters before the game releases and your direct involvement with fan base is why I keep buying your games.

Keep up the good work!

Reply #4 from StarControl Forums Top


For example, in Sins you introduced diplomacy.
For the life of me, I could not understand how to make alliances.
If before you needed to complete 2~3 assignments, now you needed to meet 5~6 criteria.

In GalCiv3 you added Citizens, why do I need them? it made no sense to me... Upgrade a citizen? Generals?
It added complexities and handicaps to a perfectly good game.

I stopped playing both games because they:

Weren't the games I bought (they changed)
Too complex for a casual player that doesn't want to learn complex game mechanics
To the point, we can see in May update that the Fleet battles in addition to the shrinking arena (new feature), worm holes (new feature) and storms (new feature), you added scavenging and who knows what else...

So, now I am thinking: "what will they do next? will each DLC change the game and make it harder to play and more obscure?"

What I hope is that the DLC will be real new content in the form of new stories, new characters, new places to visit, etc. and not a change in game play mechanics.
Why? Because I believe that you should be able to understand the mechanics of the game within 10~15 minutes (brief tutorial) and it is OK that after that it will take years to master. And more importantly, if I am used to something, why change it (unless people complained)?

 

I am going to disagree with you. Some of us who play 4x games which is what Gal Civ series is, LOVE complexity and to have it ramp up with each expansion is something I really look forward to. Look at both Gal Civ III and Civ VI (and its series) both are ok at release but needed a lot more to make the game feel more complete.

I suspect SCO will be more feature DLC oriented rather than new game mechanic oriented. New Areas, new races, more stories, I would most assuredly pay for more of those! 

 

Reply #5 from StarControl Forums Top

I agree with both your statements and would like to add that I am OK with new mechanics.
I am just less OK with changing existing mechanics.