Flagship and fleet management as exploration/story related elements

from StarControl Forums

Note: It's been a bit since I played through SC2 so I might remember things wrong, apologies in advance. And I'm also assuming that "no resource management" isn't including things like fuel/crew/RUs/rainbow worlds, etc. That the main ship makes planetfall/is the only avatar (based on that you're meant to go seamlessly from space to planet). And also going to use SC2 races in examples, since "race X" gets confusing fast.



So, back to the title. I think it's something that SC2 touched on, in the form of lander upgrades, the Melnorme lore trading, Druuge fuel exchange and the Taalo Shield/Dnyarri interaction, but I don't think it used it to full advantage. Even with a fully upgraded ship bristling with weapons, you would still get the reaction of a skeleton ship. There were no natural/physical roadblocks or choices when it came to traversal of space (beyond Quasispace). And there were no differing reactions to your presence or advancement when not directly related to story/quests.

So, just wanted to put out some ideas for maybe adding to that in the remake, which I don't think (though my experience is limited) would add too much work for the devs/will likely already be partially present, but would add to immersion and depth. Not advocating for these specific examples, since we don't have a lot of info on the design/mechanics yet, but just as a sort of conceptual framework (and it's something I think modders could do a lot with, afterwards).


More in space than planets -
For example, black holes and nebulae. Want to explore a nebula? You can, but you're going to lose crew to radiation, etc, if you don't have a particular shield upgrade (which may not be effective for combat and draws enough power it slows you down). Want to travel fast, rather than explore? A specific engine type will have you moving fast and generate a field that deflects the effects of a nebula, but only while you're in motion (stop to explore or take in the scenery and the nebula reacts as normal). Want to use a black hole like a wormhole to throw yourself quickly to different connected areas? Equip a time and space bubble device that lets you focus your own matter and slip through the eye of it (but, try and go through a nebula or land on a planet with lightning strikes and your crew is going to have a bad time). Want to avoid the hassles of any anomaly? Equip a phasing device, so black holes don't slow you down and nebula don't hurt (but, be prepared to go out with only half a fleet, as the equipment takes up a lot of space).

[How it might work: Zones for areas in space and attributes connected to planets and anomalies, a simple check for item/status/movement on the regular tick and inventory/upgrade management].


Racial reactions and relationships -
For example, the Yehat and Pkunk. Arrive at the Yehat homeworld with Pkunk ships in your fleet? Maybe they won't sell you ships as they refuse to fly in the same fleet together. Maybe they won't talk to you at all. Maybe they're so blinded by hate they don't pay attention to anything except the Pkunk ships and immediately attack. Maybe once you satisfy both races (if you can), they grudgingly don't mind or do any of that. Encounter a Mycon fleet while you have a full fleet of ships? Maybe they see you as too numerous/too competitive for the resources of the universe and attack you, regardless of your general relationship.

[How it might work: Simple check of items and quest flags at the start of interaction]


Ship reactions -
For example, you're flying a death machine that blots out the sun. Maybe the Thraddash take your word for how you can crush them into grey guacamole, rather than throwing their ships into your guns. Or you have no weapons at all, and the Pkunk see you as an enlightened brother and give you a unique gift that will hopefully keep your spirit in this universe that much longer. Or you have a specially installed crew to fuel converted, the Druuge appreciate your shared acumen and so give you a discount on goods. Or you encounter some pirates as you're flying through space and when they scan your hull they realise all you have is 1 RU and some belly lint, and let you go out of pity. Or, something like this could have no direct game consequences, but a bit of flavor text/voice to start things off.

[How it might work: Check of item/items, but perhaps done only on first contact/sets a first impressions flag]


Event expiration/immediacy and tie to gameplay (this one might not be feasible) -
For example, you spared Fwiffo. Something that might encourage replayability/different types of play, would be to expand on the concept in the encounter with Fwiffo, where mechanics use alters the outcome. Did you use the black hole upgrade to go hop across the universe? The shy Sylandro won't talk to you anymore, because the thought of that much gravity terrifies them and so you must be terrifying too. But, the Arilou might actively seek you out as you fly around, as someone who manipulates space in a similar way. Do you strip mine planets of every mineral and biotic there is? The Syreen may demand you talk to a certain number of other races and get them to agree to a galactic preservation project to make up for destroying too much natural beauty. Constantly jump into danger and travel long distances with a crippled ship? The Utwig know that you must be as depressed as they are, to have such a death wish, and maybe some of them want to come along for the ride.

[How it might work: This one, not sure of, the tracking might be really difficult. The other half would be interaction/quest flags]



These sorts of things/interactions have been on my mind lately, and after getting into the founders program today, I thought they'd be an excellent fit for SC. Thoughts? :)

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Reply #1 from StarControl Forums Top


Ship reactions -
For example, you're flying a death machine that blots out the sun. Maybe the Thraddash take your word for how you can crush them into grey guacamole, rather than throwing their ships into your guns. Or you have no weapons at all, and the Pkunk see you as an enlightened brother and give you a unique gift that will hopefully keep your spirit in this universe that much longer. Or you have a specially installed crew to fuel converted, the Druuge appreciate your shared acumen and so give you a discount on goods. Or you encounter some pirates as you're flying through space and when they scan your hull they realise all you have is 1 RU and some belly lint, and let you go out of pity. Or, something like this could have no direct game consequences, but a bit of flavor text/voice to start things off.

I like this idea, almost like having an Intimidation score, akin to Reputation.  But I think this should be limited to only what they can perceive or glean from from scanning you.  Some aliens should be more amiable/hostile based on your ship loadout/actions.  Talk softly and carry a big stick.

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Reply #2 from StarControl Forums Top

Interesting ideas here. I particularly like this one. I would force you to really think about what you are doing before you enter anyone's space with any other groups people in it.

Racial reactions and relationships -
For example, the Yehat and Pkunk. Arrive at the Yehat homeworld with Pkunk ships in your fleet? Maybe they won't sell you ships as they refuse to fly in the same fleet together. Maybe they won't talk to you at all. Maybe they're so blinded by hate they don't pay attention to anything except the Pkunk ships and immediately attack. Maybe once you satisfy both races (if you can), they grudgingly don't mind or do any of that. Encounter a Mycon fleet while you have a full fleet of ships? Maybe they see you as too numerous/too competitive for the resources of the universe and attack you, regardless of your general relationship.

One thing I personally would like to see in this game is more variation in the fleet. I can't believe that every race made exactly one class of ship like in the original games. I'd like the option of having several varying classes for each race. Ex. the Shofixti only had a scout class vessel. While I could understand they had limited technology at the point of the war, I find it hard to believe that they never had a battleship class ship of some sort. Even if compared to other races, it barely matched a light cruiser.

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Offworld Trading Company
Reply #3 from StarControl Forums Top

Hmm, can't dislike the thought of fleet variation, but think that would probably put an exponential load on the devs, in terms of making additional assets and trying to balance various abilities/etc.

Though a compromise might be perhaps linking your flagship to your fleet in terms of ability. E.g. If you have a certain upgrade installed, it would increase the firepower of the Shofixti main cannon, at the cost of halving the explosion ability. That might allow for some tweaking/variation/role change at the fleet level, without adding too much work. And it might even be feasible for Super Melee with people choosing "a flagship loadout" during fleet selection, so you don't necessarily know the exact abilities of your opponent based on their ship selection.