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Tech Trees and Tech - Specialisation

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Tech Trees and Tech - Specialisation

from GalCiv3 Forums

Hi,

 

I'am a very big fan of long Tech-Trees because I hate it if I have finished all the Techs in the middle of the game.

In the Beta 5.x the Tech Trees was not really long but now, through the specialisation the Trees are shorter than ever before

because its now only the "half" of the whole techs researchable :( 

The Idea is good that you have to specialize you and can't resaurch all the techs in one game but now you are finished with all the techs after

a "couple" of turns. That reduce the fun extrem I feel so...

 

BTW hope you understand what I like to say because I'am not really a native english speaker :(

 

 

103,506 views 33 replies
Reply #26 from GalCiv3 Forums Top

Alphaprior,

 

I am not a fan so much of the lock out on specialization, however its not really a big deal. It really isnt. Fire up a game, go big and by turn 150 or so if there is a specialization you want that you did not get, just buy it from one of the factions. 

I 'picked' better accuracy for my weapon specialization which gives like .01 to your accuracy, but I also really wanted miniaturization (-10% mass to all types). I just stayed with accuracy and when I bumped into the Iconians I noticed they had reduction spec and I bought it and all their other techs and all their colony ships (Since you only get one shot at trade and are locked out for 20 turns). 

 

Got tech!

Reply #27 from GalCiv3 Forums Top

Having to choose at certain points isn't that big of an effect on the total research time.   What is really needed (and I agree with this 100%) is to be able to slow research down.

Well, it has to be done carefully, because there can be side effects.  But to me this is the way.

This reminds me of civ 4 and civ 5.    I always played on the next slower mode down from "normal" so the units would stay useful for a significant time, and not be outdated before I finished making one.   And it seemed like I was always doing future tech research a lot towards the end.   Similar here.    So on bigger galaxies especially, slow research way down.   it makes sense and makes each stage of the game different and allows it to persist for a while.

I don't see GC3 as a half hour romp....it should be a big campaign with long term consequences for choices.   I admit I sometimes play a tiny or small game just to muck around, and there is nothing wrong with that, especially with testing out new stuff or even for bug swatting.    But (in my personal opinion) that's not the focus of a monumental 4x game, which is what I want GC3 to be, and what I think it is going to be.

People who want to play MP in a reasonable time, I agree there should be options to handle that as possible.  (Who knows  I might get in myself if it gets stable.)  But I see that as a "bonus" thing.

 

 

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Reply #28 from GalCiv3 Forums Top

Quoting Larsenex, reply 26

Alphaprior,

 

I am not a fan so much of the lock out on specialization, however its not really a big deal. It really isnt. Fire up a game, go big and by turn 150 or so if there is a specialization you want that you did not get, just buy it from one of the factions. 

I 'picked' better accuracy for my weapon specialization which gives like .01 to your accuracy, but I also really wanted miniaturization (-10% mass to all types). I just stayed with accuracy and when I bumped into the Iconians I noticed they had reduction spec and I bought it and all their other techs and all their colony ships (Since you only get one shot at trade and are locked out for 20 turns). 

 

Got tech!

I think the accuracy thing is 0,1 and to me I am guessing that means 10%.   That's a   big edge, and  my choice as well.   But I would like it spelled out.  Hey, now don't you think it's cool to have to wrangle your way to some stuff you want?

OK, I shut up...for  a while maybe.

 

Reply #29 from GalCiv3 Forums Top

Quoting Bamdorf, reply 27
 So on bigger galaxies especially, slow research way down.   it makes sense and makes each stage of the game different and allows it to persist for a while.

This is implemented in B6, near as I can tell.  Tech rate is now tied to # of habitable planets.  The turns to research techs on an Abundant/Abundant/Abundant/Insane map skyrocketed between 5.3 and 6.0.  Probably around 2.5 times as much.  Maybe more, as it's always a little hard to compare game to game.

Reply #30 from GalCiv3 Forums Top


Hi,

 

I'am a very big fan of long Tech-Trees because I hate it if I have finished all the Techs in the middle of the game.

In the Beta 5.x the Tech Trees was not really long but now, through the specialisation the Trees are shorter than ever before

because its now only the "half" of the whole techs researchable :(  

The Idea is good that you have to specialize you and can't resaurch all the techs in one game but now you are finished with all the techs after

a "couple" of turns. That reduce the fun extrem I feel so...

 

BTW hope you understand what I like to say because I'am not really a native english speaker :(

 

 

I agree that the more techs the merrier, but not to negate specialization.

Quoting drakkos137, reply 2

I agree wholeheartedly, I've been saying this for a while.

I read in the notes somewhere Antimatter Missiles are supposed to be back in, but why oh why every time we go to the "future" do options and tech vanish?

The obvious answer to this question is that the developers decided it didn't work for some reason, and I think they keep making this stuff from scratch instead of recycling from the other game. I think they should replace something they take out with something else, so at least we have reasonable techs.

Quoting drakkos137, reply 2


The adaptation?

Can you be more specific. It can only help the developers if you give them ideas.

.

Quoting drakkos137, reply 2

The ability to turn useless dead planets into something of value, or at least less of an eyesore?

I would like to do something with the class 0 planets.

Quoting econundrum1, reply 6


  and in a stratergy game extra strategic choices are good.

agree

Quoting Dumhed, reply 10

I've debated about this with myself.  I do like long tech trees.  I also like the idea of mutually exclusive specializations.  After all... its called specialization.  Though there is inconsistency in the language.  A specialization seems more likely to be exclusive.  An Optimization, on the other hand, need not be.

I've been fighting for this for awhile.

Quoting Dumhed, reply 10


The tech trees will certainly grow over time with the addition of other features (like espionage, etc).  But as it stands, there aren't enough techs for those playing on a larger map which generally takes more time to win.  You could make research slower through the settings.  However, this also changes the "feel" of the game to feel slower, rather than give the player more to do or more to decide.

I like slower maps, but I understand that you shouldn't give a fast option without having enough techs. As far as I'm concerned when a tech tree is fully researched then the game is over.

Quoting kestlstw, reply 11

The current "specializations" aren't special, they are efficiencies and should be their own lines in the tech trees.  I've been saying this for weeks, collapsing specializations aren't fun if they specializations aren't special and as that are now, they are not.

If Stardock doesn't fix this by release I plan on making my own tech trees that move the current "specializations" to their own lines, like a line for construction efficiency(-5% building costs, -10% building costs, etc), a line for building efficiency(+10% bonus to class type, etc) for example.  This still reduces total number of techs so I will have to find out what else I can add in for actual specializations but I'll be happier without collapsing specializations that aren't special.

If you could give as many examples as possibile. I agree specialisations should be kind of civilizations. Like for instance the world could go with electronics, cybernetics, or genetic engineering. Could go more environmental friendly. Rights vs security. Science vs. religion. In space private vs. government owned. As far as leading the way. individualism,  nationalism, or business.

Quoting hawkeyebf1, reply 12

Quoting Dumhed,
reply 10
mmhh I think my english is simply not enough :(

I like the specialisation but I don't like that it makes short tech trees shorter...

simply thats it...
Actually that's how I interpreted what you said. With the only exception of differentiating between specialization and optimization.
Quoting alphaprior, reply 20

Oh well I was anxious to play the Beta 6 but hate the tech specialization so much that I will postpone it untill there is a solution.
 
I don't .a gree with eliminating specialization. I think renaming to more meaningful things like religious fanatics, envinmental friendlier, cybernetics, or genetic engineering would be an example of a better setup. Hopefully other's can chime with better specialisations. I think there will need to be some of the same techs in each specialisations. Like some farmig, some morale, some weapons things like this is needed. This is a good solution. More techs are good. Picking techs to the exclusion of others is good. To sum it up I hope they keep specialization instead of you getting your way.
Quoting alphaprior, reply 20


My custom race in GC and every other strategy game I play focuses in research, so this limitation it's a game breaker to me to the point I don't like the game like this anymore.
 
Actually I don't see how this affects a research race. You could interpret this to mean that would mean that yu afe better at researching than everyone else. You could mod the tech trees to include a research branch to each tech specialization. You could mod it where all the research races don't specialize. It sounds like people are working on your mod.
Quoting alphaprior, reply 20


They made a really bad decision on this..
I disagree. I like the idea. This will probably need some tweaking as you go. Is there somewhere where we can boycott the boycotters.

 

Reply #32 from GalCiv3 Forums Top

Quoting alphaprior, reply 15

Does anyone knows how to disable tech specializations? I have found TechSpecializationDefs.xml one for every race perhaps deleting/disabling them?

I imaging that will stop the techs which are specializations from appearing in the game at all but to be fair I haven't looked at that file.

Reply #33 from GalCiv3 Forums Top

Quoting alphaprior, reply 20

They made a really bad decision on this..

In your opinion and that of some others, while in my opinion and that of some others again it's a good choice. It's hard to please all of the people all of the time. I don't particularly like the fact you can follow all three ideology trees at once but I'm having to live with it and I'm not going to not play the game because of it as there are lots of other things I like about the game.