It isn't really the Terrans fault.

The universe and all existence might be destroyed by the Terran's, but the Drengin caused it to happen! When you think about it, we get blamed for a war the Drengin started! It reminds me of a time when I was little and got punished for something I didn't d... Forget it. Lol
DARCA

Ahh, the phycologist's dream. Tell me about your father/mother relationship. Interesting.... Do you find your mother attractive? hmmm.... Tell me about your deepest fears....

Technically, you could argue that the Entente started WW2 with the punitive terms of the Treaty of Versailles, but that doesn't make the Nazis any less evil or responsible for their own actions. Although admittedly lumping all of the Nazis' atrocities under "WW2" is intensely problematic, considering almost everything else they did was far worse than waging war against foreign powers :/

Right, I still blame the Drengin, the Thalan should too, or at least acknowledge that.

So because someone punched you in the mouth, that gives you the right to use a NNS? Hmmm...

 Only if they used brackets in their post...

The Drengin just wanted to get their hands on Precursor technology, by using a Precursor artefact. They didn't knew, that doing so would free the Dread Lords. At least, not that I'm aware of. Still, they weren't bothered by it, because it served their purpose just as well. Let the Terrans and their allies fight against the Dread Lords. Any survivors will then be crushed by the Drengin.

You can't really blame the Thalan in this. The events happened too quickly for them to actually do something (except for warning the Terrans not to do what Draginol suggested). They may get another chance when the Crusade begins, but I'm not so sure, if they will be any more effective.

If anyone is to blame, it's Draginol. He probably told the Drengin where the artefact was. He definitely told the Terrans about it. And he later told the Terrans how to get into the Pocket Universe, wherein the Dread Lords had been imprisoned, and suggested to go in there to get access to all the left-over Precursor technology. He instigated all of the events, just for this to happen.

Lol lol lol. The million dollar question is why though? A peaceful* arnor, mithrilar, and I secret that can destroy the universe, how do they fit together? As someone once said "As long as your enemies die with you, you lived fine." so let the Drengin die at least.

I do wonder with so many dormant story elements still, possibilities run so rampant I can't bare to elaborate on my hypothesizes. :/

And its still the Drengins fault for starting all this because they Planned all this. Sorta reminds me of the "Fate of the Jedi" series were Sith wanted power and got more than they bargained for, forcing the Skywalkers to learn the techniques of there enemy to survive.

Why what? Why Draginol did it? Without spoiling too much, it's basically a time-loop. He has to do all this, or else the GalCiv universe as we know it would not exist. If you want to know more, Frogboy has spoiled most of it in some of his posts on the GalCiv 2 forums.

If you want to go that route, then it's the Terrans fault, because they gave Hyperdrive to everyone. Without Hyperdrive, none of this could have happened.

Also, if the Terrans hadn't been so ruthless in their war against the Kendar, and tried to make alliances with everybody, the Drengin wouldn't have seen them as big as a threat. This means, that the Drengin probably wouldn't have felt the need to go looking for Precursor artefacts to gain an edge.

Xendar, not Kendar. Also the old texts stated the Drengin wiped out the Xendar so the humans wouldn't learn about their involvement in the war. And it was the Drengin that gave technology to the Xendar and told them to attack the Terrans.

Right. Sorry about that. (Bloody typos... )

True. However, it was the ruthlessness the Terrans showed in the way they waged the war, which gave the Drengin pause. Up until this point, they only knew the Terrans as traders and diplomats. I.e., weaklings, easy to be crushed. Now the Terrans suddenly showed great skill and cunning at waging war, and the will to totally annihilate their opposition, which was completely unexpected. If the Drengin hadn't wiped out the Xendar themselves, the Terrans would have done so anyhow.

^^Still the drengin's fault, they orchestrated all that too, and hyperdrive had no malicious intent. Just because something went wrong doesn't mean all of existence was a mistake, all events would subsequently lead to the moment hyperdrive was invented, so is the entire past to blame for it? I think not, the buck stops with the the drengin.

With all this into account (which I had previously done before making this post) the drengin touched the damn artifact, they were the stupid tools in all this. Terrans were only dragged into all this, they are innocent of all choice made. Thalan need to look in a mirror and take some responsibility and say "sorry, we added to all the woes by messing up the whole universe time saving thing. Won't happen again."

So its Drengin, Draginol, Thalan in that order. Drengin caused this, Draginol encouraged this, Thalan failed to stop THIS! Terran still wondering if they can sell bottled water afterwards.

Can you link me the spoil to this you mentioned earlier, would help?

Well if they can travel in time they could interrupt events at any point and no longer have a need to eradicate the humans, indeed it might be simpler to intervene at an earlier time when much smaller action than genocide was needed. The again how detailed was their knowledge of past events and how humans came to the point of being a threat to the universe? To interrupt the chain of causality earlier they would need more detailed knowledge of past events. Maybe they should have sent a few intelligence agents into the past to sniff things out first.

It isn't outright stated, but you should be able to piece it together, if you read the following posts:

The Dread Lords, the Arnor, the humans, and the Altarians

The Galactic Civilizations Universe

The Reluctant

Also, stop blaming the Thalan. They tried to prevent it, but the humans didn't want to listen. Here is the description of the last mission in the DL campaign:

Earth is safe -- thanks to the Salvation Device. It has surrounded the Earth in an impenetrable field. While the Drengin have Earth surrounded, they cannot invade. And we have custody of the Salvation Device.
Now is the time to escape. But where should we go? The mysterious figure has arrived again. He... It... continues to wear a long dark robe. As he approaches, Izok of the Thalan arrives in a shuttle. He has insisted that we not talk to the mysterious figure!
Izok claims that the mysterious figure will lead the entire galaxy to ruin. In response, the mysterious figure unrolls his hood revealing himself -- he's human! He calls himself "Draginol".
To us he says, "The galaxy is shattered, crushed by the evil Drengin and their allies. But the real lords are the Dark Arnor -- the Dread Lords. You have but one hope. You must return to Karion. On Karion is the temple with the device that brought the Dread Lords here. It is too late to send them back, but the device can send you and your forces to where the Dread Lords were. Think of it -- the Dread Lords inhabited that place for centuries, the power and devices that must still be there are the only hope for the free peoples of the galaxy. You must go there and in time, return. Your return will be the beginning of a great crusade to rid the galaxy of evil and tyranny and put an end to the Dread Lords once and for all."
In response, Izok disagrees, "No, that is what we have been trying to tell you. The Thalan are not of your universe. Humans have interefered too many times in the affairs of the galaxy. Your Hyperdrive technology was only the first step. As bad as it is, there are worse things for the universe as a whole than one galaxy dominated by these Drengin creatures. Humanity has been manipulated from the beginning by greater powers. Without your Hyperdrive technology, none of this would have happened. What this 'Draginol' suggests will lead to greater ruin."
If you go to Karion and to the place of the Dread Lords I have no doubt you will return. And your "crusade" will end in fire and death for all living things. That is why we are here, we were sent to stop you. But events occurred too fast and now it's too late so I can only appeal to your... humanity. You must not do this thing."
The Draginol figure looks vaguely familiar though you cannot quite remember from where. However, the decision as to whether to leave the Earth imprisoned forever or to find hope for the future is a no-brainer. Earth WILL be saved. We will go to Karion.
Draginol explains that at the temple we must bring our ships as close as possible. Once the device is activated, our ships will be teleported from our universe to the pocket universe that the Dread Lords were in.
Karion is occupied by the Dread Lords. We must take it back.

The Thalan method of time/dimensional travel is a one-way trip, as far as I know.

I smell a rat!

in which case the drengin are dumb anyway and deserve death. And Its at least not the terrans fault, who would have listened to Ikoz? Better to die choosing freedom that die a complacent prisoner without a plan I believe. Thalan didn't give much of a alternative, how do they know the Yor or Drengin don't conquer the galaxy or universe? or discover some other terrible weapon ( as super weapons seem to be just laying around in galciv, from terror stars to whatever is hidden on Altara.) that could destroy the universe or screw things up?!?!?

And if hyperdrive was manipulated into existence... A REALLY sinister realization just popped into my head. I'll shut up now.

So the title of this post will be changed its not the Terrans fault, I learned something today, and checked out some library books. Sounds good. (and there's Monday night football!)

DARCA ;- )

And stop laughing at us (me) Brad, we (I) don't know better!

Was all this in the Galciv 2 campaign?  Or is this some sort of fan fiction?   I have played GC2 for years but I never completed the campaign (Just did the first couple of maps and lost interest.)  I always play sandlot (or what ever the term is)

And now we get multiple parallel universes started. Wouldn't it be fun if we could get the game to provide them, including each point at which a time line splits into two separate time lines? (Shades of "Back to the Future".)

Edit: My "quote" button is not working again.

@Bellack

Nope, it's official. It was in GC2.

Fascinating. I always believed if we actually made it into space as a united species, we would be much more like the Drengin than Star Trek's view of humanity. We have a much too violent past, and are way too efficient at exterminating opponents and weaker peoples. If we could do that to each other, why  would we treat aliens any differently. As long as we have the technology, we will fight to control and be on top. 

I seriously thought money was the motive of such evil. Ya know, kill a deer get the antlers, and start celebrating...

Wasn't everything peaceful on earth in lore though, apart from the time we started killing the Xendar*? Its the 2200s, I would imagine at 2050 life on earth will have a lack of war due to a lack of dictatorships and regimes. IIRC no two democracies have ever been at war.

And star trek sucks because its poorly written and is ignorant to science and facts.

DARCA

Darca1213 we will never agree on Star Trek (I'm a trekkie.)

Quoting DARCA1213, reply 20

I seriously thought money was the motive of such evil. Ya know, kill a deer get the antlers, and start celebrating...

Wasn't everything peaceful on earth in lore though, apart from the time we started killing the Xendar*? Its the 2200s, I would imagine at 2050 life on earth will have a lack of war due to a lack of dictatorships and regimes. IIRC no two democracies have ever been at war.

And star trek sucks because its poorly written and is ignorant to science and facts.

 

DARCA

That is a common fallacy.  There are numerous instances of democracies going to war with each other dating back to ancient Greece and as recent as the 2000s when Russia and Georgia had a brief little war.

Ancient Greece? You think they were a legitimate fair democracy without gods and kings? I've read the history books too and see it slightly differently.

Thats wacko logic, f^<k1n9 Russia!!! Russia, a fair and Sovereign democracy lord god lol. Then why did they basically invade Georgia for becoming a democracy if Russia already was supposed to be one? Wait don't answer, Russian government is a collective of evil dictators, period.

Have you ever asked a Russian what type of government they have? They always say Communist. They either love it or hate it but the answer is always the same, not a democracy.

Facts bro.

DARCA ;- )