Any tips for countering the mass flak rush?

Seriously, this is causing me to hate playing multiplayer. I keep getting owned by this strat ever since it first appeared a few months ago. The basic premise of the rush is that you drop down two military lab at the start of the game. You then immediately start pumping out flak after the research finishes. The reason its so overpowered is because it counters all early game ships. Lrms and vettes are useless against them.I tried building light frigates but my opponents keep shredding the cobalts armor with their powerful autocannons. 

How do i beat this powerful strategy? Do i need to tech up and spam dominas? Someone told me vasari minelayers worked well against flak, maybe I'll try that next game...

9,447 views 6 replies
Reply #1 Top

I have seen mass Hoshikos do very well against Flak. They have Anti-Heavy attacks and with the Flak's spread-out damage they can live forever by repairing each other. If you rush the Demolition Bots power they are even stronger. Advent also has the option to use Wail of the Sacrificed and nuke a flak fleet but it's risky, if you can't tech up to it before they are swarming your home world it may be GG.

Reply #2 Top

Can you post some recording where this alleged flak rush is being used successfully in MP? I can imagine flak spam working to some extent later in the game, but a flak rush exactly as you describe it starting with "drop down two military lab at the start of the game" would be astounding to see working vs. another skilled human [TEC/Advent] that spammed LFs and rushed with them too.

I've seen "pro" LF spammers just sit back for a long time building up their force (to 50-80 ships) without initiating any serious hostile action in enemy territory in the mean time, but that's really a bad strategy; someone like Grimm or Doci would laugh at that kind of "LF turtling". Since you watched and commented on the 1v1 game they posted, you probably know why that's so. My guess is that if you do run into someone who spams LFs but just turtles/defends with them, flak rush might work because it would be then equivalent to a [later] spam if the enemy doesn't press you early on.

The other thing that might make this possible is starting at the max distance (between HWs) in those 10-slot random maps, which is 5 jumps (perhaps 6 jumps is possible too, but I've not seen it these maps) as opposed to the "close quarters" 3 jumps that seems to me is the common setting in those maps (occasionally just 2 jumps shows up too, but that's also rare). 5 jumps separating HWs is more common in the 8-slot random maps (compared to 10-slot ones) and perhaps becomes the prevalent distance once you go to 6-slot maps (where 6 jumps separation can also be found occasionally), but I'm not sure how often those 4v4s and 3v3s are played on ICO.

So, recordings or at least some more details are needed to see the full picture that you're painting...

 

Reply #3 Top

I don't think this was a serious post lol. But it would be interesting to know how viable a "flak rush" is in longer distances between HWs, like 5 or 6 jumps.

Reply #4 Top

Yeah, he was probably being facetious, along the lines of his posts about the "double Kol rushes" (https://forums.sinsofasolarempire.com/454907/page/1/), "Advent mine spam" (https://forums.sinsofasolarempire.com/454605/page/1/), and so forth.

Except that countering LFs with flak is somewhat more plausible (than the other stuff) on an equal fleet supply basis (but less so once you consider the full econ early game) and also somewhat plausible if you play without pausing the game, because the LF counter-maneuvers are [ironically] more involved that those needed for the flak [that they're supposed to be a "hard counter" for]. He also posted a replay of microed flak vs. unmanaged/AI LFs in a large scale battle (https://forums.sinsofasolarempire.com/451948/page/1/) that lends some plausibility to this flak rush, unlike the clearly joke topics about double Kol rushes and what not, for which he posted no replays...

And in case you haven't figure it out yet, Sinkillr, Hydralig, Stilat,  and probably others are "sock puppet" accounts of the same person.

 

Reply #5 Top

Oh I'm well aware lol. Only Stilat seems to be posting atm since everyone knows who the alts are. Hydraling got banned I think.

Reply #6 Top

Quoting WJC3688, reply 5
Oh I'm well aware

:troll: