Fleet Destruction Combos (AOE abilities)

from Sins Forums

This post is an attempt to list and rank all the Rebellion abilities and combination of abilities that can cause wide spread destruction to enemy fleets.  This isn't meant to be a ranking of usefulness of these abilities/combos, but rather a listing and ranking of their potential power.

Tier 1 - Instant, Uncapped Destruction without Consequences

- The Maw + In-Gravity Well Jump - With a level 6 VL Titan, enter a gravity well, jump to a frigate fleet, engage Maw.  Not only does the fleet die within 5 seconds but you gain resources for each dead ship.  Its possible to wipe out over 1000+ fleet supply worth of frigates with this ability.  With the in-gravity well jump, the enemy fleet can't escape before you jump to them.  The only limitation is that this requires level 6 on a Titan that isn't very useful until it gets to level 6.

Once you get this ability, no group of enemy frigates is safe.  Even carriers can't escape this combo.  This is by far the most powerful frigate mass destruction ability in the game.  The Maw hungers...

Tier 2 - Instant, Uncapped Destruction

- Wail of the Sacrifice - For the loss of a Desert or Terran planet (or sometimes an Ice planet for weaker frigates) with full population, the Advent Rebels can use this ability to destroy (or causes massive damage) to all enemy frigates in all adjacent gravity wells.   Executes through a Temple of Communion at the planet being sacrificed.  Also causes moderate damage to enemy capital ships and enemy structures.

This ability spreads destruction over a very wide range and is devastating to enemy frigates but costs you a very valuable planet.  You can also use it in combination with Malice for even more destruction.

- Override Safety Protocol (Big Red Button) - TEC starbases, when upgraded with 2 levels of override safety protocol, can self-destruct and take out almost everything within a very large radius with them.  The upside is that enemy frigates and low level (or damaged) capital ships are destroyed.  The downside is that you lose the starbase and this ability also affects friendly units.

This ability is the most powerful mass destruction ability in the game in terms of what it can kill (did I mention that it takes out capital ships too?).  However, it doesn't have the range of Wail and doesn't provide resources like the Maw.

Tier 3 - Massive Destruction

- Chastic Burst + Malice - Fire up Malice on the Advent Mothership and then Chastic Burst on the AR Titan.  With high levels of each (level 3+), large numbers of frigate die.  Both abilities have to target the same set of ships and Chastic Burst has to be used before the Malice time limit expires.

This combo can be used multiple times within a battle to destroy huge numbers of enemy ships.  Depending on the situation, it may take more than one use of this combo before ships start dying.

Advent Note:  The Advent Rebels and Loyalists have a number of AOE abilities that can be combined with Malice.  It is possible to use multiples of these abilities to significantly increase the their total damage potential.  I.e.  Malice + Chastic Burst + Meteor Shower or Malice + Cleansing Brilliance + Scream, etc.  The key is to get the multiple abilities all to active within the 10 second Malice window.

- Cleaning Brilliance + Malice - Same idea as Chastic Burst + Malice.  As an Advent player, fire up Malice, fire Cleansing Brilliance at the same set of ships as Malice (targeting a ship in the back so that Cleansing Brilliance does more damage), and watch enemy ships go pop.  Timing is critical with this combo as Cleansing Brilliance takes time to line up and then charge up.

Cleansing Brilliance is a level 6 ability on the Radiance Battleship and has a long cooldown so you likely only get one shot at this combo.  However, if done right, it can take out a lot of enemy ships.

- Scattershot + Explosive Shot - Both of these abilities are on the TR Titan and both cause moderate AOE damage to enemy fleets.  When both are upgraded, the TR Titan can alternate between them causing massive levels of damage to a large number of ships over time.

- Missile Barrage - Use the level 6 ability on the Marza dreadnaught as TEC to target and kill large numbers of frigates at one time.  To use, move the Marza into the middle of the enemy fleet and active this ability.

This is a level 6 ability with a long cooldown.  It also has the disadvantage of spreading its massive damage out over a period of time giving the enemy a chance to run away / interrupt the barrage.

Tier 4 - Massive Destruction over Time

- Demolition Team + Boarding Party - The TEC Corsev Battlecruiser has the ability to blow up friendly ships in order to cause AOE damage to all surrounding enemies.  Damage is doubled if the blown up ship was originally taken from the enemy with Boarding Party.   The ability has good destruction potential when used multiple times in a battle.

- Fracture + Scream + Malice - The Advent can use this Malice combo much like Chastic Burst + Malice.  Fire up Malice, fire up Scream, cause destruction.  Add in Fracture before Scream for addition damage.  This combo has good damage potential when used multiple times in a battle.

- Nano Leach - VR Titan ability that drains hull points and antimatter from surrounding enemy frigates.  Slowly kills the frigates while healing the Titan and restoring its antimatter.  The real power in this ability is in making the Titan nearly indestructible when enemy frigates are close but it also does slowly kill large numbers of enemy frigates.

- Suppression + Subjugating Assault - This combo of abilities on the AL Titan effectively traps enemy frigates near the Titan and slowly "steals" them.  Not really an AOE that causes destruction, but this combo is very effect in dealing with moderate sized fleets of frigates.

- Meteor Shower - Ability of the Advent Starbase to cause AOE damage to all nearby enemy ships.  Can be quite deadly with multiple uses.

- Disruption Matrix - Ability on the TEC Loyalist Titan that does moderate damage to all surrounding ships.  Although it does some damage that can build up over multiple uses, its main purpose is to disable ability on all ships within its range.

- Volatile Nanites - Level 6 ability on the Kortul Devastator.  Increases damage to nearby enemy ships and causes then to each do a moderate amount of splash damage when they are destroyed.  Most effective against large numbers of relatively weak targets.

- Radiation Bomb - Ability on the Marza Dreadnaught that does damage to a single target and then a moderate amount of damage to all enemies near the original target for a short time.  Can be effective against tightly packed targets with multiple uses.


Please let me know if I have missed any AOE abilities or combos that can cause large scale destruction of enemy fleets or if I missed anything with how they are ranked.

 

Edit:  Moved Scattershot + Explosive Shot up to Tier 3.  (7/21/2012)

Edit 2:  Changed the names of the Tiers to more accurately reflect the potential for each ability/combo.  Added the ability to combo Wail of the Sacrifice with Malice.  Changed the wording on the Maw combo description to be more objective.  (7/21/2012)

Edit 3:  Added note on Advent Malice combos and added Disruption Matrix, Volatile Nanites, and Radiation Bomb to Tier 4.  (7/24/2012)

43,714 views 26 replies
Reply #1 from Sins Forums Top

Eradica and Ragnarov should also be tier 1. You have to take their cooldowns and the fact they can use those abilities from the start into consideration. They are usually much more terrifying than the maw.

Reply #2 from Sins Forums Top

It takes so long to get a Vorastra to L6 that even if you do, I'd have switched to capital-heavy fleets which are completely immune.  Chastic Burst+Malice on the other hand I would argue is the most devastating above because it has one of the highest damage potentials in the game and is pulled off easily with no consequences.

BRB does 9,000 damage.  Wail of the Sacrificed deals 6440 at most.

Chastic Burst + Malice is higher..  Much much higher...  That's 1,115 damage to begin with plus the propagation from Malice which in this case means that the maximum damage output is 10,481.

Technically you can go higher.  Cleansing Brilliance has a higher damage cap but because of the nature of the ability is much harder co combo.  Its maximum however is 23,500, enough to knock out anything that isn't a titan or starbase.

Without including interracial synergies, Malice+WotS is the most powerful in the game, dealing a mind-boggling 60,536 damage to afflicted units.  Seeing as how you're hitting everything in the gravity well simultaneously, I don't think is exactly hard to pull off.

Just for good measure though, let's take into account the most powerful AoE synergy in the game: BRB+Malice.  BRB deals more base AoE damage in the game than anything else and to say that it is easy to hit things with it is an understatement.  Malice+BRB deals 84,600 damage.  That is enough damage to kill any capital of any level.  Even with AFF active, Kol will take at maximum 79,025 damage before dying.  Titans however can shrug this off.  Orkulus Rex can take 220,000 damage before death.  The Ankylon, 243,000.  With more effective health than any other unit in the game due to extreme health, armor, and shield mitigation, the Coronata can absorb 276,000 damage before falling to a single blow.  (In practice, the Ankylon will be much harder to kill due to its defensive abilities that heal it very very quickly.)

Sins of a Solar Empire II
Reply #3 from Sins Forums Top

Quoting Volt_Cruelerz, reply 2
Without including interracial synergies,

I'd be interested in a post on strategies of this type, especially early game combinations that team players could (should) use to good effect.

 

Reply #4 from Sins Forums Top

Well first off, the Vasari don't have many AoE's.  Their titans have them, but everything else is just is just single-target.  As for the TEC, Radiation bomb could work decently well, dealing effectively the same amount of damage as Psionic Scream, only in a DoT instead of a burst.

Reply #5 from Sins Forums Top

Tier 4 - Moderate Destruction over Time

- Scattershot + Explosive shot - Both of these abilities are on the TR Titan and both cause moderate AOE damage to enemy fleets.  When both are upgraded, the TR Titan can alternate between them causing moderate destruction to a large number of ships over time.

WTFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFF!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

Moderate??? really?, i use scattershot+explosive shot and all enemys go boom!,this is tier 1.... really, moderate is no this rank, i put on moderate disrruption matrix, but in lvl 4 it do nice damege too.

 

Quoting GoaFan77, reply 1
Eradica and Ragnarov should also be tier 1. You have to take their cooldowns and the fact they can use those abilities from the start into consideration. They are usually much more terrifying than the maw.

 

YES YESS AND YES! :thumbsup:   true history

Reply #6 from Sins Forums Top

Quoting GoaFan77, reply 1
Eradica and Ragnarov should also be tier 1. You have to take their cooldowns and the fact they can use those abilities from the start into consideration. They are usually much more terrifying than the maw.

I'm very much in agreement that the Eradica and Ragnarov are much stronger Titans at the point in most games where it really matters and the game is being decided.  My thinking for having their combo at lower tiers than the Maw was that Chastic Burst + Malice is target limited to the number of ship Malice affects and that Scattershot + Explosive Shot takes multiple shots kill frigates (although both are VERY effective).  The Maw is instant kill with unlimited targets.  I wasn't thinking as much about cooldowns as a well placed In-phase Jump + Maw kills what you want killed in the first shot.

Quoting Vash_AMR, reply 6
Tier 4 - Moderate Destruction over Time

- Scattershot + Explosive shot - Both of these abilities are on the TR Titan and both cause moderate AOE damage to enemy fleets.  When both are upgraded, the TR Titan can alternate between them causing moderate destruction to a large number of ships over time.

WTFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFF!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Moderate??? really?, i use scattershot+explosive shot and all enemys go boom!,this is tier 1.... really, moderate is no this rank, i put on moderate disrruption matrix, but in lvl 4 it do nice damege too.

I hadn't look that closely at Scattershot + Explosive Shot since they got buffed in 1.3.  You're right, they don't belong in Tier 4 - they are probably in the same range as Chastic Burst + Malice.  I'll move them up.

Reply #7 from Sins Forums Top

Quoting Volt_Cruelerz, reply 2
It takes so long to get a Vorastra to L6 that even if you do, I'd have switched to capital-heavy fleets which are completely immune.  Chastic Burst+Malice on the other hand I would argue is the most devastating above because it has one of the highest damage potentials in the game and is pulled off easily with no consequences.

BRB does 9,000 damage.  Wail of the Sacrificed deals 6440 at most.

Chastic Burst + Malice is higher..  Much much higher...  That's 1,115 damage to begin with plus the propagation from Malice which in this case means that the maximum damage output is 10,481.

Technically you can go higher.  Cleansing Brilliance has a higher damage cap but because of the nature of the ability is much harder co combo.  Its maximum however is 23,500, enough to knock out anything that isn't a titan or starbase.

Without including interracial synergies, Malice+WotS is the most powerful in the game, dealing a mind-boggling 60,536 damage to afflicted units.  Seeing as how you're hitting everything in the gravity well simultaneously, I don't think is exactly hard to pull off.

Just for good measure though, let's take into account the most powerful AoE synergy in the game: BRB+Malice.  BRB deals more base AoE damage in the game than anything else and to say that it is easy to hit things with it is an understatement.  Malice+BRB deals 84,600 damage.  That is enough damage to kill any capital of any level.  Even with AFF active, Kol will take at maximum 79,025 damage before dying.  Titans however can shrug this off.  Orkulus Rex can take 220,000 damage before death.  The Ankylon, 243,000.  With more effective health than any other unit in the game due to extreme health, armor, and shield mitigation, the Coronata can absorb 276,000 damage before falling to a single blow.  (In practice, the Ankylon will be much harder to kill due to its defensive abilities that heal it very very quickly.)

I agree that Chastic Burst + Malice has more utility in a real game than the Maw does.  At the late stages of a real game you need to be able to kill capital ship and the Maw doesn't help with that.

That said, the In-Phase jump + Maw combo is instant kill for frigates with an unlimited number of targets.  Chastic Burst + Malice is target limited by Malice.  That is the reason I had it higher.  I think that I confused the issue with the titles I choose for each of the Tiers.  I'll change them to be more in line with how I was thinking.

Thanks for the feedback on this post.  There are several of you guys this forum that know this game a lot better than I do.  Let me change the titles on the Tiers and then let me know if you think they are still out of line.

Reply #8 from Sins Forums Top

You should be doing your best to take the titan out before it gets to level 6. Which is why i think the maw is rubbish, and if you cant get the right angle it also becomes useless, splitting your fleet up too... 

Chastic is certainly my fave, it works from the get go and can secure your fleet dominance. At which point in most games, you've almost won the game for your team, the kills add to the exp of the titan, the titan gets stronger as your enemies get weaker. win, win. Mass bombers and hope for the best.

Reply #9 from Sins Forums Top

The splash damage on VL titan also falls under Tier 4 if your enemy is stupid enough to group their ships together.

Also, just for everyone to remember, Malice used to be an AOE, so just imagine what it could do in the hands of a skilled player with Cleansing Brilliance.

Reply #10 from Sins Forums Top

Put disrruption matrix of ankylon on Tier 4 - Massive Destruction over Time. Is good ability, i like.

 

I dont know.... The maw is THE ULTIMATE ability for me, i devouring 3 fleet on an epic battle against IA, but ragnarov and erradica + malicia, can destroy all too, but with some time.

Any test inspire and impair? with the orky rex? xD my friend use inspire and impair, i have alll upgrade, and the orky rex attack rise to 470 / 200 / 340 xD, Mother of all starbases :D.... orky rex hit like a FINAL BOSS!.

 

Ankylon is a very nice titan, not be underestimated, enemy starbase under inspire and impair lvl 2 have 60 / 40 / 55 of damage... is more funny for me than use ragnarov with massive destruction in 2 second :/

Reply #11 from Sins Forums Top

Seems like everyone has forgotten lvl 6 ability on Kortul...certainly would be a lower tier but it has it's uses....

Don't know why Malice+facture+chastic burst or CB isn't on there...

Reply #12 from Sins Forums Top

Both Malice/Cleansing Brilliance and Malice/Chastic Burst are up there in T3.

Reply #13 from Sins Forums Top

Hadn't even thought of it but Nano Leech and Volatile Nanites would be quite painful..

Reply #14 from Sins Forums Top

Quoting SpardaSon21, reply 13
Both Malice/Cleansing Brilliance and Malice/Chastic Burst are up there in T3.

They don't include fracture though, that's what I'm saying...

Hit fleet with malice, then fracture (and maybe even then psionic scream), then chastic burst...

Reply #15 from Sins Forums Top

Well, techincally you could go..

Cleansing Brilliance -> Fracture -> Malice -> Psionic Scream -> Meteor -> Chastic Burst

but then, how often does that happen to line up?

Reply #16 from Sins Forums Top

Quoting Volt_Cruelerz, reply 16
Well, techincally you could go..

Cleansing Brilliance -> Fracture -> Malice -> Psionic Scream -> Meteor -> Chastic Burst

but then, how often does that happen to line up?

 

Find common denominators and use and/or for the combos. Or don't post a combo with more than 2, and list them according to total power.

Reply #17 from Sins Forums Top

The common denominator there was that they were AoE's being empowered by Malice.  The reason that Cleansing fell first is because it has a charge time.  I was giving an order in which to cast things as an AR for maximum effect.

  1. Cleansing Brilliance: cast this first because it has a charge time
  2. Fracture: this prepares everything for the following nukes and directly empowers Psionic Scream
  3. Malice: cast this just before CB fires to ensure you cover all 8 seconds of CB with Malice's 10 second duration
  4. Psionic Scream: Malice and Fracture are in effect, so fire this next
  5. Meteor Storm: it's an AoE, use it
  6. Chastic Burst: this is an incredibly powerful nuke and you already have Fracture and Malice

When Malice ends, everything afflicted by the status will die.

Reply #18 from Sins Forums Top

Bdelong, Very nice list, thanks for putting it together.

- Override Safety Protocol (Big Red Button) - TEC starbases, when upgraded with 2 levels of override safety protocol, can self-destruct and take out almost everything within a very large radius with them. The upside is that enemy frigates and low level (or damaged) capital ships are destroyed. The downside is that you lose the starbase and this ability also affects friendly units.

This ability is the most powerful mass destruction ability in the game in terms of what it can kill (did I mention that it takes out capital ships too?).

But, I don't think the Red Button can kill Cap ships?  At least I've never observed that.  The max 9,000 damage is reduced by shield mitigation (-65%?) to around 3,150 dmg?  The lowly Advent Halcyon has 3,675 hull+sheild to start with.  So the cap ship would have to be damaged first?

This is why I thought the uproar about the Red Button's beta buff was mute, because the higher levels of damage at that point, really made no difference against anything.

Reply #19 from Sins Forums Top

Red Button can take out capital ships.  The main use of Red Button now is to guard incoming phase lanes.  Once the whole fleet is in range, Red Button right away.  If you don't attack the invaders, their Shield Mitigation is low, and Red Button can blow up everything.

Reply #20 from Sins Forums Top

Quoting Howdidudothat, reply 10
The splash damage on VL titan also falls under Tier 4 if your enemy is stupid enough to group their ships together.

Are you referring to the Desperation ability?  I haven't had a chance to try it out and wasn't sure exactly what it does from it's description.  Does anyone have stats on how this ability works?

Reply #21 from Sins Forums Top

OK, added a note on Malice combos and Disruption Matrix, Volatile Nanites, and Radiation Bomb to Tier 4...

Reply #22 from Sins Forums Top

IIRC, it maxes out with a passive reduction in damage of 5% or so and some moderate splash damage but when under heavy fire, it's cooldown will drop by 60%.

Reply #23 from Sins Forums Top

hahaha. i cannot believe this is not mentioned:

 

You need: 

 1x Vasari Rebel Titian 

however many kortul you might want to abuse.

 

 

Here is the kicker: The kortul  starts with 2 insanely powerful abilites: The drain antimatter on hit abilitie (disruptive strikes) and the power surge.

The kortul is probably also the hardiest cap in the game since its self healing is so good. Anyway:

The combo sets in as soon as the kortul has reached level 6 to gain acces to its nanites. And is increased in effect as soon as the Titan has level 6 for Dissever (500 flat damage + 30 damage dot on all leeched targets. ALL targets. No upper limit here...)

 What nanites do is debuff enemies so they take 30 percent more damage and make enemies explode with 300 deathnuke.  That means that frigate swarms will essentialy cease to be any sort of concern for you. They cannot kill the titan since their presence  ensure it can get massive benefits for leech. They also spend a lot of tiem being stunned by grav pulse. The frig swarm will constantly be worn down by leech, which later on combines with nanites and disseveer to deliver a 45damage/sec dot. The horror? The dot gets amped by nanites and every ship that dies (essentially all small frigs are fodder for this) create explosions that damage the rest that again damage more when exploding.

 

 

The nightmare horror- horror? You cannot kill the titan. You cannot kill the kortul (or rather kortuls) supporting it since they not only self heal but also get healed and AM boosted by the titan (which you cant kill). but once 2 or more kortuls are shooting YOUR fleet, your antimatter will essentialy evaporate. Malice combo? nope. Titan abilites? lol no. Top that with a massive increase to cooldown times and the fact that kortuls can spray enough targets (due to their weapon placements) to even endanger the AM of your fleet (which will die soon anyway) and you have a veritable nightmare.

 

And then theres the starbase which will probably also be there. which you also cant kill. since it has that 200 % shield and eats your wrecks. for hp. Oh and its damage factors into the nanite thing too... 

  The nastiest thing: you cant even shut up the kortuls anti matter destruction sicne its a passive.

  Fro added horribleness add one or two carrers with nano heal or some evacuiators for added dots.... and for eating planets....

 

Did i mention that this basically works with you NOT having a fleet?  (basically yo ukeep a fleet back home to coutner attack while your kortul/titan/starbase team butt f+0cks the universe. (kudos for bringing an andvent friend to add malice ....)

 

As for the Tec titan and marzas: have a dunov's use emp two or three times times on the enemy fleet. shields will be gone. All damage profits (marzas and titans love not shooting shields... ).

 

Advent:  

Both titans are horrible and instead of buying those you should get more radiances to brilliance the enemies fleets to death.

 

 

Reply #24 from Sins Forums Top

Quoting Levelheaded, reply 24

Advent:  

Both titans are horrible and instead of buying those you should get more radiances to brilliance the enemies fleets to death.

Last time I checked the Eradica Titan is one of the most powerful and that it's only real drawback is the lack of a level 6 ability (ie having to die to use).

 

Reply #25 from Sins Forums Top

Quoting Rovert10, reply 25

Quoting Levelheaded, reply 24
Advent:  

Both titans are horrible and instead of buying those you should get more radiances to brilliance the enemies fleets to death.



Last time I checked the Eradica Titan is one of the most powerful and that it's only real drawback is the lack of a level 6 ability (ie having to die to use).

 

 

its self boosting ability lasts only as long the advents supply of new fodder lasts, the antimatter based nuke will be gone once the am is gone.... dunno about most powerful, but it certainly did not impress me so far.

perhaps you can enlighten me on this one?