Titan Tech

Just military tree, which will probably be getting a huge overhaul thanks to corvettes and the like anyways. I don't think it will have anywhere near as many tech upgrade as the starbases do now anyways.

They might have a massive amount of up-grade a ship that is suppose to be able to take out entire fleets may have the same amount of up-grade as a starbase. I wonder if starbases will be up-graded to handle deffending against a Titan?

I bet that loyalists/rebels will get their own titans, and the loyalist/rebel tree will be mostly for those titans.

The reasons Starbases got so many tech tree upgrades were that they were meant to be used early mid game, yet had to increase in power in order to stay relevant late game. I don't think Titans be this way, its likely they will be the sort of game ending unit Sins has never had. If the Devs go in this direction then I doubt Starbases will get much of an upgrade. Basically building a Titan should be like building the Death Star, you've got to spend a lot of resources and time to get one, but once you have it your opponent will need to throw everything they have at it in order to stand a chance of taking it down.

I want's a "Death Star" Titan.

Here you go. Courtesy of the Advent.

Wow, shiny.

What happens to your giant ball if I fire an enormous artillery gun nearby?

I really hope this isn't the direction they go. I don't like games to have "game ending" units because quite frankly it leads to an "end of the game" rush then no end game to play because whoever reaches the top first ends up dominating completely.

I do want a game ending unit. Once you get into the late game with multiple players building 3 starbases on several planets it's just a pain to get through them. Allowing players to have that "ultimate dagger" to break a deadlock is a good idea. There is also no reason you can't build your own so if you aren't completely incompetent the game won't break even with an unfair unit added to the game.

Well a lot of the community thinks otherwise. One of the big problems competitive Sins games have had is that it takes too long to finish on suitably long games. The MP system basically expects teams to just surrender after the other team gets a sufficient advantage, as it wastes everyone's time if the losers just try to hold out until the end. I don't think Titans should be unstoppable, but there appearance should begin the last stages of the game. Think of Supreme Commander, just because you build a monkeylord doesn't mean you've won the game, but it does make annihilating your opponents base much easier if they haven't been playing well enough to have a strong defense force to stop you.

That said I have no idea how IC will actually set it up, though if Titans aren't sufficiently powerful to end most games I will probably make a mod that will fix that (though sadly that will be of no use to the multiplayer community). Likewise if they are too much of a game ender for your taste, it should be pretty simple to remove them. That's what mods are for, personalizing the game to your tastes since the game developers obviously can't please everyone.

When I mention that I don't want a game ending unit I don't mean a unit that can be used to break defense bulwarks. That is obviously very needed considering it's possible for a person to build a massive bulwark of defensable systems in this game that as people have said force "end game" to end with surrendering. However what I mean by referencing supreme commander is that a monkeylord doesn't end the game. However pre-experimental and experimental artillery can and WILL end the game because it allows a person to simply shoot at your base no matter where your base is and potentially wipe you out.

This game needs a good bulwark breaking unit. But when I say "game ending" I mean quite literally you build one and you pretty much have free reign to do what you want. Plow through the enemy systems if you want. That is not cool. Everything should be defensable. But defending against a titan should require a significant amount of your resources which will leave you weak at other points should the titan not be able to break through that particular point.

I think one of the biggest problems with this game is that the scale isn't well designed. You can have small maps that can be done in a reasonable amount of time but a lot of people would probably like larger longer maps but as it stands right now those do end up lasting too long.

I just don't want a scenario that means you've built a titan yay you win. That isn't fun. It should be more like "Woohoo I've built a titan it's time to get my boom on!"

Well than it seems we agree, to me these are all game ending units, though I'd much rather have something like a monekylord than uber artillery. Tthough we do sort of have these in Sins already with the superweapons. Problem is they really don't do their job all that well.

Or they could be like the SupCom 2 experimentals and current Sins capital ships, expendable and expensive, but can be a real pain to annihilate during early game. Late game would consist of having as many as possible.

Which is exactly why they won't be like that. The Sins developers are very much against similar unit roles, whatever they have planned for Titans they will be quite different from capitalships.

Imo Sin's Capital ships are important and carry weight because they level up and it can take quite abit of effort and work to get them to higher levels which in turn makes you want to protect them. If Titans don't "level up" then they need to carry weight and be important for other reasons otherwise you simply end up trying to push out as many as you can, or if there's a limit pushing one out everytime one dies. It gets really meaningless.

I think the description for entrenchment star bases was initially that they could take on entire fleets. With the info we have of titans, I imagine they would be stronger and regardless of their abilities, their purpose is that of a war vessel first and foremost. I am sure like star bases, they will have their weakness.

I think if there was more info into why the rebellion for each race, it might help with the speculation regarding the purpose of the titans.  I am assuming the story is that some are not happy with the diplomatic direction and so they form splinter groups. I wouldn't be surprised if there was a new mechanic similar to culture, diplomatic relations, etc.. which some how plays into the purpose of the new capital ships and possibly titans.

Super Weapons in SOASE are almost pathetically weak as they stand. Star-Bases right now are in fact the true "Super-Weapons" of the game.

Granted, they are for defense, or in the Vasari's case - an infeasible offense (let's be honest, you aren't gonna build one in an enemy well and have it make an impact worth mentioning before it's taken out in its infancy unless you already cleared the well or have a fleet so amazing that the Orkulus won't matter).

Titans? I'm assuming honestly that they are just the offensive version of a Star-Base. I don't think they're gonna be much - if at all - more powerful than a fully upgraded Star-Base. If a Star-Base is a nut, a Titan will probably just be the nutcracker.

I have the feeling Star-Bases will become less relevant - especially the Orkulus (with a Vasari Titan, why ever use an Orkulus on the offense?) - with these new Titans. IMO the super-cannons need some love, or they will go from mostly obsolete to entirely obsolete.

Titans run the risk of invalidating all previous content... making Star-Bases and the Super-Cannons largely irrelevant. It's going to be tricky balancing this.

Kinda hopeless of me to say, I know. Sorry. That said, I'm still buying rebellion !

-Itharus

Make it like Krogoth from Total Annihilation.  Super expensive and super long build time, but would stomp legions of lesser units if you pulled it off.  However the factory building it was a giant target for nukes/artillery/bomber rush to easily shut a player down.  It needs to be huge risk, high reward to fit into the game without overshadowing over options.

I have read a lot of things lately on forums dealing with titans. The game REALLY NEEDS something powerful, I enjoyed playing mods having a supercapital or capitalships that were a bit powerful and expensive than the others. Entrenchment made a change in this situation, the powerful starbases were put in for defense purpose but still nothing for a deadly assault. Almost all sci-fi races have a supership so I think it's necessary for Sins to put some big thing into the game.

I don't agree with you about starbases, I think there are no huge changes needed, they are excellent defense units the way they are now. If they change the overpriced or useless ugrades (Colony pod- my heart hurts for it because it would be an excellent idea but whith this small population no, and the Induced Reverence needs to be more powerful)

I agree with you about superweapons. Even in Diplomacy I don't build them very often because I don't think they worth their price, but I think they will be changed somewhat to fulfill the Real Super Weapon (but immobile structure) role.

Even though it was quoted as a "work in progress", it's bigger than a star base...

how about that the tech required to obtain the titan is an end tech for the military/defense/empire trees. 

Each tech would require 8 labs and be at the end of each empires tech tree or they could require a 9th military/civilian lab

I didn't think this one through but an example could be some like this:

TEC Military Tree: Miniature Novalith Cannon, the pride of the TEC is their ability to miniaturize the Novalith cannon and mount it to the frame of the ? titan class ship.  Required to create ? titan  Cost: 5500 credits Metal 2500 Crystal 2000 Requires 8 Military labs.

Civilian Tree: Best and Brightest, The TEC searched every world under their control and every record for the best and the brightest military strategist and commanders to work on the ? titan ship.  Required to create ? titan.  Cost: 2000 Credits Metal 5500 Crystal 2500

Defense Tree: Hephaestus Shipyard; The TEC constructs the largest ship yard they have ever created to make the ? titan. Required to create ? Titan Cost Credits 2000 Metal 2500 Crystal 5500

Total cost of the research to create the titan would be Credits 10000 Metal 10000 Crystal 10000

Those of course are just examples and could be changed or moved around but you get the basic idea.  Each of the 3 trees would have a tech that was required and each tech would be at the end of the tree. 

The high cost of each tech could force a strategic choice do you want to spend those resources to create one ship or spend them to further improve your other ships or empire.  You could almost replace an entire fleet for the cost I suggested.  Also such high cost would definitely make it to where loosing one Titan is a big deal, as it would be large amounts of resources that went down the drain. 

Basically a late game changer if you can afford it...

Not a big fan of having multiple titans.  I'd just prefer them to have abilities be researchables at the tops of their respective trees.  You want a supersized mobile constructor?  Want a freaking juggernaut that steamrolls all planets in its path?  Research those respective categories.

As for all the ?'s, look at the picture, It says Athena.  Therefore, TDN Athena.

*laughs hysterically*

LMAO

or not!!!