What if they'd sold it to Microsoft to merge into GFWL? Or Valve, to poach the users for Steam? It can always be worse.

Actually DD DOES dominate over retail for PC games, as of last year, and is the growing part of the market. Retail is on the way out for PC games.

People who don't accept Steam aren't as numerous as reading this forum would lead you to believe. And really, they have D2D, GoG, etc as options. If they don't want Steam and they don't want Gamestop-Impulse, it's not like there's no other options.

 

Unlikely. Creating standalone patches is a lot more work then using a DD updater system. That's one of the reasons Ironclad moved patches to Impulse for Sins, when originally it had standalone patches.

And TBH, you won't buy a Stardock game because of the patching system, but the fact that the last two games Stardock published (WoM and Demigod) were *both* unplayable out of the box didn't bother you? That seems like a odd set of priorities to me.

Both of those would be preferrable to me over GS, even though Valve isn't a realistic scenario. MS is much more realistic. There is nothing inherently bad about GFWL. It started as terrible as Steam, but it improved considerably. In DoW2 it still was iffy and ultimately Steamworks proved better - but at least with that MS showed a willingness to improve and had results to back them up. GS shows no such thing. MS would've been a better all-around choice.

I was (and still am) sick on the weekend, so I fired up Arkham Asylum for the first time. GFWL wanted me to log in. Then register the game. Then told me it had an update.

So it patches, restarts... then prompts me to login again becuase it forgot who I am. Put that in again... and there's another patch.

Patch, reload, log in again (because that "save password" checkbox obviously works so well), and there's ANOTHER patch!

From the game loading to the game being playable was 15 minutes of GFWL nonsense. It can burn in the fiery pits of hell. The only other game I've ever had it inflicted on me in was Fallout 3, and I had similar problems there. My buddy at Bethesda commented that "there's a reason we abandoned it after only one game" when they switched to Steamworks.

 

I asked Gamestop and it is not an April Fool.

Like Tidus said, I'm not sure that the percentage of people who hated Steam is enough of a market share to go worry about, especially given that many of them hate any form of DRM or digital download service and will reject Impulse no matter what form it takes. And I agree that it would have been far worse if Impulse had been sold to Steam to cement their monopoly.

I used to like Gamestop back in the day, but like many people I don't really like going there any more if I can possibly help it. But then I'm also not really their target market any more either. I can accept that it's hard to be a brick and mortar game store these days, and that it may require adapting in ways that not everyone will like.

I try to keep an open mind about them as a digital distribution service. Clearly many people here think that they are the spawn of satan, but I've found that at various times on these forums you can find people saying that about almost every company.

Well, you can add me to the list of Steam and DRM haters. Let me be perfectly clear. I will never use Steam unless they remove all DRM and the requirement to run a client.

My game purchases were made, in order of preference:

1. GOG (no DRM, client, etc.) - Far and away my preference
2. Impulse or Retail (only for non invasive DRM titles)

I'm going to wait and see what happens with Impulse, and thus hold off on purchases for now. In the meantime, I'll be investigating GG and other alternatives. I'm not happy.

I used to think Stardock/Brad cared about their customers. However this belief has been weakening the past few years. I've never cared for the requirement to have Impulse to install and update games (but it didn't seem to get in the way afterwards, like most other DRM). The selling of Impulse and Brad's recent comments have made me believe that he just told us what we wanted to hear long enough for him to cash in.

 

I think they still do. They may have screwed up in some very big ways lately, but I've never seen a company respond to its own mistakes with the amount of maturity and respect that Stardock showed after the Elemental fiasco. I believe I can still trust them to enforce a certain minimum standard of quality for their games.

That doesn't mean I'm happy with them right now. Impulse was the only Digital Distribution service that I trusted, and that was solely because of the reputation of the people running it. My concern has always been that such services necessarily grant to the retailer an inappropriate amount of control over their customers' purchased property, and the enforced amorality of publicly-traded corporations ensures that such control will be abused whenever possible. Stardock appeared to be the only company around whose leadership had both the desire and ability to refrain from that abuse, but apparently Brad is still willing to do it by proxy.

I can't really blame him, though. He wants to make games, not sell them, and Impulse only happened because he thought a Steam monopoly would destroy PC gaming and no one else was doing anything about it. If Brad doesn't want to give up his dream job to pursue a glamorous career in retail, who am I to argue?

So I guess this is where things stand:

• I can no longer trust Impulse with any future purchases.
• Anything I have already purchased through Impulse is going to be backed up, to a tangible medium if possible.
• I will probably still buy Stardock games, so long as they and any other involved parties do not possess the ability to block access to what I've purchased. Assume that I will be installing your product from disk to a non-networked system located in a cabin in the woods a hundred miles away from what used to be civilization.
• Stardock has blown all of its diplomatic capital and their reputation with me is now close to where it started. That isn't a bad place, but it's definitely several levels below "fanboy". Maybe it's better this way; my opinion of you guys was getting to be a bit unrealistic.

 

That went on longer than I expected and I doubt many people care, but I guess I just had to get it out there.

 

I've agreed with many of your points, but I think this one is crossing the line. Worse choices that come to mind, in no particular order: Apple, Microsoft, Electronic Arts, Valve, Ubisoft, Ebay, Sony.

Better Choices: Google, Amazon.

Ultimately, DD wasn't going to survive with just indies running it.  The big boys were going to start muscling out the little guys at some point, and now we're seeing it.  Things move fast in today's society, and big money controls everything.

 

I just hope steam's current dominance will force Gamestop into not messing with the core base of Impulse customers.  Honestly, I think the rage around here, while justified, may convince Gamestop that you guys can't be kept, so why bother?   I can't speak for everyone, but Gamestop will get one chance from me.  Stardock would have gotten multiple chances, but Gamestop only gets one.

 

 

I was speaking of brick and mortar retailers.  



I've seen nothing to support this.  I read contestable information that digital downloads may be surpassing physical sales.   May be.  Not has.  And surpassing, Not dominating.  If the market was dominated, then people in the industry would not be arguing if DD has surpassed physical.  It would be clear.  49% of a market is sizable.   So is 40% and even 30%.  When DD surpasses physical sales with a 75-80% share, then I'd say the market is dominated.  But even then, that 20% market is gonna be valuable enough for someone to service.  We are still talking many millions of customers here.




C'mon give me some credit here.  Do you really think I base my thoughts off of data gathered from such a limited set as these small forums?  For over ten years, and from points all across this world wide net, I have been reading people discuss digital distribution.  And I continue to dialog this subject with friends, family and coworkers.  Even with strangers as we wait dutifully in line to make our brick and mortar purchases.  

I am left with the strong sense that a sizable population is inherently distrustful of electronic distribution services.  I find clues across the net, in peoples homes, at jobsites, in public places, over the radio waves, and in movies and television.  Alot of people have issues with an ESD marketplace.  Some are concerned about product ownership, some about privacy, others about the loss of local taxes, and much more.  I think of this group as the ESD Timids.  People who for a wide range of reasons, are reluctant to participate in the ESD marketplace.  This is a much broader group than steam haters.  Now, A portion of the PC Gamer segment, of this ESD Timid population; viewed Impulse as their sole safe gateway into the world of digital downloads.  It stands to reason that a portion of that specific sub-population will no longer view Impulse as safe when a publicly traded company with Gamestops record takes over.  Hence, the sale of Impulse has slowed down the transition to a digital marketplace.

You nor I can quantify these populations into accurate numbers.  But when it is estimated that over 60% of the heads of households in my country purchase video games on a regular basis... even a small percentage of the gaming population equates to many millions of people.  The minorities are sizable.  And at this time we are at best talking about a 51/49 to 55/45 split between ESD's and brick and mortar.  Even should the gap grow to 90/10,  the minority will be significant and won't be ignored.  Someone will capitalize of those willing customers.  

And keep in mind, that every time a game goes digital only, it skews the figures.  How can you accurately compare digital vs physical sales, with so much digital only product entering the mix? 100% of Fallen Enchantresses sales will be digital.  That in no way means that people would not have bought a physical copy of it had they the choice.   And understand that the digital sales data is bloated by $0.99 games.  Even the distribution of Demo's and free games has been said to bloat the figures.   

 

I don't know first hand the costs of standalone patches.  But I do know that where there is a will there is a way.  Stardock has struck me as a company who goes out of their way to service their customers.  Beyond that, if they believe that their method of patch distribution will limit future sales, then mayhap they are motivated to provide an alternative.  And Brad did say some time back, that they were considering going so far as snail mailing patches on CD to E:WOM customers.  

 

Eh?  I am still bothered by buggy releases.  But I am resigned to buy buggy boxes where the post sale patch support is sufficient.  If I no longer have access to patch support, then I will no longer risk buying buggy releases.  

I was speaking of brick and mortar retailers.  But I agree that Amazon and perhaps Google would make a better choice.  They are monster sized companies with all that entails.  But they don't pwn a retail market in the way which Gamestop does.  

I remember when Google was a humble little company lol.  I immediately jumped on their bandwagon back in the day that Yahoo dominated.  I'm still riding it.  And remember when people said Amazon couldn't last?  Now anybody can make a website and earn an Amazon commission from selling anything from shovels to automotive parts.  

 

What I'd like to see is for some fit company to provide brick and mortar retailers a way to download and then sell hard copy games to their customers.   This would create jobs where a digital only market loses more jobs than it creates.  It allows for more local tax revenue to fund our cop shops, fire departments and schools; whereas digital cuts our communities completely out of the loop, and at a time where the feds drastically cut back their funding.  It challenges the power that Gamestop holds over its brick and mortar competitors.  All the while providing game developers with all the goodies that a digital marketplace allows.  Win win win.

http://kotaku.com/#!5789323/indie-dev-pulls-game-in-protest-over-gamestop-takeover

cheesus...

Well, they've got the right to do that if they want... and as they apparently are distributing through... EVERYWHERE else...

Anyway, so they hate gamestop for whatever reasons.  And as a portion of the profits of their game will go to gamestop after the sale is finalized, then its logical if you are distributing your game on every other platform (apparently, they don't have a problem with steam... just gamestop ), then it's not really going to hurt them all that much to drop impulse.  So, good for you for sticking with what you value.  That and the stand they are making probably won't impact their bottom line in any way, shape or form.  wooo...

They were active in the thread a few days ago.Was interesting because he admitted that Impulse had been good to them, then leaves anyway. I'm wondering if maybe a Gamestop employee ran over their dog.

What happens to all my games when Gamestop goes belly up in the next industry crash?

Suggest reviewing the market at some point.  Gamestop is about as likely to go under as mcdonalds. 

To be fair, if there's one thing that is very likely is that GS has a much, much smaller chance of going belly-up than SD. They make insane profits with the console game resales, and that's not going to change.

What happens when Gamestop is sold to Steam 

And with the way SD is running their business regarding the Elemental franchise, it would not be a wonder if they folded within six months.

http://www.quartertothree.com/game-talk/showthread.php?t=64160&page=9

To quote one of the developers:

Might be part of why they do not have a problem with Steam, the contract there may have better protection in it.

I'm sorry but that's nonsense.  The contracts with Impulse with regards to Star Ruler don't change simply because Impulse, Inc. has a different stockholder.  If he wants to remove his game, we can certainly grant him that.  But I know that Gamestop is very interested in promoting indies.

Clearly "worse" is a subjective judgement.  I'd pay $50 right now to have all my licenses transferred to Steam.

Name one time in modern, relevant history Gamestop has been interested in something not created by a major publisher. Just one.

I'm not trying to troll Frogboy. I just have 0 interest in Impulse anyone, and frankly 0 interest in Stardock since Elemental isn't my kind of game. The company is just no longer relevant to me, which is sad. I think that describes a lot of people here.

Buying Impulse?

lol, fair enough! But seriously, Gamestop just sees the money in digital distribution.