Is There Another Story Behind the Ground Zero Mosque?

lulz.  It's like a Dan Brown article!  "Help solve the mystery of the mysterious floors of evil Muslim mosque and the shadowy organizations that inhabit them". 

 

 

 

 

I notice you can't refute the info.

ID, you're forgetting something!  One of the most beloved people is investigate this......well sort of......

She is going to find out who is behind the financing of..................................................the anti-ground zero mosque.

Its a good thing that Nancy Pelosi is around for who else would be doing this and pushing the media to found out who is truly behind this 'racist' 'bigot' group.  It can't be families of those who lost loved ones in 9-11.  It's only 2 blocks away!!!

I don't understand how hard its to understand the reason to find out who is financing the Mosque. There is a Mosque like only three or four blocks away from this proposed mosque.  Heck, why don't they just get the Bin Laden group (Not Usama, the other part of his family is still in construction and this is where they made most of their money) to construct it as well.

yea, I saw that Reichs Marshall Pelosi was afraid that free speech was again poking its head above the cesspool she had confined it to. 

if nothing else, a republican victory in November will banish her back to the dungeons of Mordor from whence she sprang.

As For ID's article: Who cares?  What they do behind their doors will be done whether it is on 2nd street or in the Bronx. 

Refute?  I just don't care. 

I 'get' the reality here:  The mosque - at the very least - is in poor taste, but there isn't anything anybody do about it.  Most people, at least those who have managed a C in their high school civics class, understand that there's nothing you can do about it. 

That sort of situation, in which the irrational types can't compete with what's rational - often results in such conspiracy nonsense---like these clowns who would love for you to believe that Al Quaada is getting offices in downtown NYC.

 

But look, we already have plenty of nuts looking to enforce their religious values on the rest of the country.

 

yea, Sharia law is a bitch, aint it.

The second PDF is full of the sort of events that you would expect a community centre to run 

 

That website seems to base a lot of its evidence on its own guesswork about the size of the building and makes up what it thinks will be in there.  At what point does any of it say that the USA should enforce Sharia law?

The Sharia project is what they are working on.  As I said before, there are too many unknowns here, and obviously we can't trust the media to find out.

Follow the money.  

I wouldn't go that far. All it would take is a change in the zoning of that area and the Mosque is no more so you can't say nothing can be done. You seem to jump to different sides of things depending on your opinion. When Obama became President everyone seemed back then to have the power to change things, now all of a sudden you seem to think they don't. How is it that people like you can so carelessly have 2 points of views on the same thing and push one or the other at any time depending on your own agenda?

If some States can protect illegals (considering the name itself describes a person who broke a law) without getting sued, other states can get sued because they are enforcing existing laws, we can be foreced to buy something or be fined for not doing so (Healthcare), we can have our taxes raised even after a promise that it would never happen, etc; what makes you think such a concept as Shariah Law would not be, to a certain extent, be accepted over here since we are trying to form better relationships with Muslims, we claim to respect other religions, we claim freedom of religion and more than anything this Gov't refuses to use terms that describe terrorist and such just to avoid angering the Muslim community? Seems to me that with all the slack we keep cutting to Muslims with the people in NASA being asked to focus on forming relationships with Muslims as if that is has anything to do with sending rockets to space and stuff, I wouldn't be surprised we allow Muslims to get away with such religious laws, after all, aren't some airports putting foot baths for Muslims? Aren't they already allowed to take time off during work or school to pray the what ever many times they do?

What the hell does that diatribe have to do with the point?  Your point appears to be 'well somebody who is kind of like these people in some way might at some point do something completely different to what these people are trying to do at this point'.

Where is the evidence that these people are trying to get the USA to have sharia law?  The sharia law, from what is linked in the documents, is a monitering project not an advocacy project. 

They are trying to extend their project designed to STOP conflict between the various bronze age creation myths

 

 

sorry I meant 'The sharia project, from what.....'

This monstrosity will not be erected.

I find it amusing in a way. People that wouldn't piss on a Christian or Jew that was on fire, because it would go against their non or anti-religious beliefs, seem to be queuing up in support of Islam. Is it the school yard crowd mentality (you know the ones that yell fight, fight)? Is it the perception that any enemy of my enemy is my friend? Or is it the perception that religious people are conservative, so normally non-religious liberals or progressives (some not all) just see it as a means to swipe at their opponents? I've noticed this on many news sites and blogs in the comments. I do hope this brew-ha is over by Christmas so they can go back to protesting nativity scenes and the like.

Can it be built? Yes. Should it be built there? No, it's poor taste. It's that simple, no politics necessary.

 

Right.  And certainly don't forget the 'family values' types who believe their their god should be setting the rules down here. 

 

And we'll grandfather in the OTB and the strip joint?  Or what?  Kick'em out? 

 

I've only rendered one opinion:  It's in terrible taste, but not much that can be done about it.  Incidentally:  stupidest statement ever.  Of course I argue my opinion.   

 

What are you talking about?  I've never said any of that.  I've said on at least one occasion that there were 3 reasons I nodded Obama: 

1.  Selfish:  he's a hometown guy and around here, we tend to take care. 

2.  He's a sox fan (He really is, but this wasn't one of the reasons - I just say it because it pisses wingers off)

3.  His opposition with a 5000 year old man from Arizona and a vice president from.....Alaska. 

 

How is it that people like you can project perceptions?  I haven't had 2 points of view. 

 

You'd have to define 'a certain extent'. 

Obviously, take your extremes out of the discussion and assume whatever degree would ever rear it's obnoxious head would be watered down.  At it's high point, I'd imagine you're talking something like one of the suburbs over here that has an extremely large population of orthodox jewish folks.  By orthodox, I mean little o not big O (although it could be big O, I have no idea)  They largely maintain their customs, dress, etc. just based on being a majority in that area.  Anybody can live there, but hope you like shopping kosher.  That's of course internal enforcement of their beliefs and assuming those beliefs are reasonable---w/ev. 

The other side of that---a more temperate flavor would be what Christian fundamentalists do, in that they create squawkbox organizations and try to drum up support to make their beliefs law.  When they start to lose or evolve enough, they'll do just like the fundies and cook up psuedo science.    I would assume that whatever talking points they cook up on the agreeable issues would ultimately match what the Christians would be saying. 

And so what?  They're going to lose anyway. But that's just it:  they're just religious kooks.  They're either the benign keep-to-themselves kind in the former or the pain in the ass kind in the latter.  and we already have both. 

Although, admittedly I do occasionally surf through the news from places with large muslim populations to see if any of that (the latter) shit is starting.  There's a poor suburb near Chicago and sometimes when we go to visit I'll read the news out of Dearborn. 

Charles' comment makes me wonder whether there's an actual push amongst real life new yorkers to push for a zoning change.  I know both sides have dancing bears at this point - msnbc had the former SG who's wife was killed in 9/11 and he supports it, and fox ran some clown over the weekend who was a rescue worker and is against it. 

 

But I'd be curious to see what the actual beliefs of New Yorkers are. 

Muslims - yea, they do have some nasty laws they seem to want to impose (and have in some cases - NJ domestic abuse???)

Have you actually seen zoning laws?  In NJ (I do not know about NY, but figure it is just as easy), they have zoning that allows strip joints, but not churches!  Zoning laws can be as rational or irrational as the governing board wants them to be.

 

I would say that the ad being run by the victims and families - all New Yorkers - indicates that there is a lot of opposition to it locally.  That plus the fact the whole brouhaha was started by a local person.  Contrary to what they Wicked Witch of the West would like to think, this is not an organized opposition.  it is a demonstration of America's first amendment rights.

A picture (or video) is worth a 1000 words. You may not like the site, but then no one has complained about the video being photo-shopped or dubbed.

http://abcnews.go.com/US/Politics/islamic-center-backers-rule-taking-funds-saudi-arabia/story?id=11429998

Yeah....

Right.  And don't forget 'family values' champion, literally a Lula hero, and Eagle Forum founder who believes that if a husband sexually assaults his wife, "it's not rape".  There is consent by virtue of being married. 

But really:  keep your head in the sand on that one.  There's absolutely no similarities between the two.  Sure they both believe in imaginary men and think the government should be run on their ancient rule systems - but nop---nothing to see here. 

 

Like I say:  both sides have dancing bears at this point. For every 'victim's family' that you have saying no, you've got one that says "it's ok".  I'd like to know whether they're actually is an charged opinion one way or the other on this in NYC.   

 

 

 

Are you referring to Lula, who posts on here?

She is not Muslim.  Nor am I Lula.  You have a gender ID issue along with ADD (this is not your blog nor is the subject Phyllis Schlaffly - your worst nightmare)

Link to it.  I see no link, so I think you are just blowing smoke.  Clearly the national polls do  not reflect the NY Polls since they are a separate country, right?  As you said, keep your head in the sand.  Or more appropriately, keep your fingers in your ears and keep yelling lalalalalalalala

Indeed I am. 

 

I'm just pointing out the absurdity of you beefing with muslim folks for advocating quite a bit of the same your beloved christians do. You were the one who brought up domestic abuse.  I was just pointing that there are conservatives like Lula who support those who believe as bad and worse. 

 

Link to what? The 'dancing bears'? 

Here's Ted Olson, former solicitor general, who's wife was killed in 9/11:

http://tpmdc.talkingpointsmemo.com/2010/08/911-widower-ted-olson-obama-was-right-on-cordoba-house.php

Here's some dancing bears from the other side:

http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&safe=off&tbs=nws%3A1&q=9%2F11+survivor+cordoba&aq=f&aqi=&aql=&oq=&gs_rfai=

 

Well, that's kind of my question.  Let me be more explicit for you: 

I assume, with the national prominence that this issue has become clouded by....you know...gap toothed hill billies.  I wonder if there is actually enough give-a-shit to actually do something about it at the local level. And, given the inevitable accuracy of my initial assumption, as a matter of fact, there's a clarion example of such right now - it might as well be a different country.

 

 

 

 

Of course re-zoning would force the four churches and one synagogue that are within two blocks of ground zero to move as well!

I've listened to the video and the only quote says from the guy in questions says nothing about the US, in fact the commentator talks about Sharia law, in the same way as in Britain which kind of throws his views into question. He also says there are no prominent peaceful Muslims at all

There is nothing about imposing shaira law - and don't forget that there as many version of sharia law as there are interpretations of the Christian bible. 

There is nothing about trying to convince the US to have sharia law

Even if (and please note this is a hypothetical situation) he got the laws of the US changed via democratic means isn't democracy in action?

 

You really beat up on people that aren't even present to defend themselves.  You done this several times you bring up a persons name that posts here who is not even involved in the conversation (it doesn't further the discussion any, either. It would be like me saying something about Big Fat Daddy or Mason if I had a beef with either of them as well.  Which I don't).  Seems like the only reason to do this is just to punch them in the face.

 

  English is a terrible language to translate anything in, for the most part it is a functional language.  College graduates use about 20,000 words at most.  The English language has about ~350,000 words.  An educated person uses less than 10% of the English language.   The multiple translations of the Bible say the same thing but use different synonyms for words.

Actually, if you look at the Hadiths, it gives a pretty clear picture of Shai'ra law is.   Most Muslims countries have the same principle laws in some of the finer details there are little tweak differences.