Go use Hotmail and tell me they don't data mine just like Google...

Yeah, riiight.

How convenient... that you leave out the bit where I said "evidence of data mining purely to target me with ads".  OK, misinterpret, misconstrue... bastardise my intent, but it does not detract from the fact that Google is an intrusive internet scumbag, which is the crux of my argument, not what MS does or does not do.

Again, this takes out of context what I really said.....

However, the point being made was not so much to comment on MS, but to highlight the difference to Google's invasive practices, that MS offers the option to opt out of its advertising materials... whereas Google does not, and that was/is the point being made.  I have been using MS products and services for the last 7 -8 years, and I have yet to receive unsolicited emails/spam from MS and/or its partners. 

The only materials I receive from MS and/or its partners (Corel, Adobe, Nero, etc) is because I registered products/services and subscribed to their newsletters, and therein lies the difference... Google (if you let them) bombards you with unwanted/unsolicited advertising spam and does not take NO for an answer... there is no unsubscribe function to opt out, and one should not be forced into installing ad-blocking/script-blocking software to not be annoyed by Google spam.

Also, I have not turned a blind eye, nor am I ignorant.  MS may very well pass information to its partners for marketing, developmental purposes, but as I said before, I have yet to be pestered by unsolicited MS/partner spam/promos/advertising.... meaning that MS and or its partners are NOT as instrusive as the bastards over at Google, which did target me until I stopped using its products, services and blocked its site with AdBlock, etc.

Put bluntly, I have some tolerance for MS data mining practices... for Google's I have NONE.

You crack me up Starkers. Your logic is flawed.

I'm so pleased that I amuse you, kona, that has made my day.

However, my logic regarding Google is no more flawed than anyone else's... unless of course they think the sun shines out of Google's proverbial arse.  Thing is, I opened my eyes and am not blinded by the Google hype and: "Look at all the free services we are providing"  If Google were purely a search engine provider who had a few free apps on the side, well I'd be a little less hostile towards it... but it's not... purely a provider of free services.  

With everything Google does there are agendas and commecial strings attached, seeking purely to profit from your data/usage... and none of it is free.  Google charges its clients huge sums of money for on-line advertising... and those costs are passed on to the consumer.

Furthermore, as Jafo alludes to, Google "uses market oriented censorship" and floods the internet with information of its own choosing... meaning that products of non-Google clients get buried and consumer choice is thus restricted to what they want us to buy/know.  Now think, if you will, what this does to market competition and pricing... how a 'Google' oriented world helps create a monopolistic marketplace because it keeps popping up the same retailers/providers, while neglecting other reputable dealers who offer the same or similar products with great service at a competitive price.  This is how/why many smaller operators go to the wall.. and why the larger, monopolistic ones think they can charge consumers whatever the fuck they like.

What really gets me is how many people think that Google is "God's Gift" and believe it is the best search engine in the World, when clearly it is not... because if it were, Google would not restrict search results to what it wants you to see/buy, but provide all-inclusive results to offer consumers greater choice.  No, what Google does instead is repeat several provider entries dozens of times over several pages, as if to say: "Oh looky, see what we have done for you.  Nope, that does not a good search provider make... and let's not confuse paid ads with search results... two different animals.

Google has the technology and resources, the all feeling all knowing tentacles to provide all-inclusive search results, but it chooses not to display them, and this serves to create an uncompetitive, captive market that's designed to serve compliant slaves to monopolistic practices, which is why I get out into the stores and research when I want/need to buy goods. I refuse to be led around by the nose and be indoctinated like that, by Google or anyone else... and no, yahoo search is no better when it comes to consumer choice.

Not only that, Google/Yahoo/online shopping makes people lazy.. and how may people have swallowed the online blurb about a certain product only to find it's not what they want/all it was cracked up to be once it's delivered.  Nah, get out into the stores and research/check it out yourself... it's amazing how many choices/alternatives there are in the 'real world'

@ Jafo #59.  Yeah, everything you said.

Better? How???  Better at excluding results that may be of interest to you!  Better at documenting your search history so as to aim... NOT aim certain products at you!  Better at conditioning (brainwashing through repetitive advertising) to get you to buy the products they want you to buy.  Better at censorship/lying by omission

Oh well, if that works for you... but for me, well I'm glad I pulled my head out of the sand before my brain got too adled.

If you get anything from this topic, it should be a sense of paranoia.

And my prior response to Starkers wasn't intended to prove Google was better than Microsoft as far as data collection - but to reject a prior (in this topic) statement that could mislead readers that MS was somehow 'better' wrt to targeted adverts based on MS' data collection on its web service customers.  I'm strongly in the camp that says MS' web services and data collection policies are not user-friendly.  I feel the same about Google, though in practice I've had an easier time blocking their personal data mining than I have had with Microsoft's services (e.g., MSN, Hotmail, Live).

I don't use adblock to protect myself. I use it to block annying banner ads. Nothing paranoid about that. Adblock is not a program that one uses to protect one's self. It's just used to block ads from being seen but they are still there.

I think you need to read up on adblock.

Good point...ever heard of a bingplex? Bing sounds more like gaudy jewelry.

Same thing, isn't it?  You know, protection against brainwashing and subliminal messages... protection against accidentally clicking on an ad and ending up with spyware, browser hijackers and other nefarious scripts that hypnotise and say: "BUY, BUY, BUUUYYYY???

Yup, I'd say there wos something paranoid about that. 

Don't need to... use it to block distracting piccies when I go to the Playboy site... I go there to read the articles, you know.

Um, you sure you're using it right?

Hello, Pot....this is Kettle.....

So it doesn't matter to you how the search results may just be filtered/adjusted to suit an undisclosed agenda?

Say you're a Chinese student of Sociology in China....researching civil disobedience and anti-political dissent in your country....and you search with Google....and get bugger-all hits.

Gosh....conclusion is....the Chinese Administration is a bunch of nice guys that everyone loves....

Groovy...