Will Multiplayer be Rejuvenated With 1.1

I just recently got back into the game and I'm  playing 1.5.  There are just as many players now as there were in June, when my old computer melted (70-90 during peak hours, 30 offpeak).  The main gripe I've had was seeing a lobby of ten players who couldn't host.  1.1 should fix that, and that coupled with radical rebalancing should give this game a new lease on life, imo.

I think the ability to host is what really hurt the online community....hopefully some of those people trickle back with the Alloy enhancement in 1.1.  I think the rebalancing and other fixes are just gravy for the veterans.  =) 

Entrenchment will probably be the factor that actually pulls people back to the game and revitilzes it.

Yeah, I take your point about Entrenchment. However unfortunatley I won't be getting Entrenchment nor the other so called expansions. In the UK sins costs about £27.50, which is the price of many PC games. Add on another £27.50 for all three expansions, and you are looking at a very expensive single 'PC' game...the cost of two PC games in the UK.

I like a lot of other gamers out there dont join the random gamers in the lobby, and opt for predetermined play times with friends and friends-of-friends to hammer out space justice!

A good bet is to get involved with a ring for SoaSE players, and do the same, if you are having difficulty finding fellow players.


Normally you'll notice that there are 4-10x or more as many players in a game as there are in the lobby, I belive thats the root of that effect.

You never bought an expansion before?  Most strategy games have them when they are successful, and they usually run about 3/4 the price of the original game. Most of us would rather spend our money on this expansion than some other game.  What game are you buying instead?

Cykur, do you think the expansions will actually get played online?  I'm under the impression that the primary purpose of the expansions was to throw a bone out to the people who only play single player and who get bored playing against the predictable AI (but who haven't figured out that the way to enjoy a better game is to play online).

We're going to set up some game days too to help organize the revitalization of multiplayer.

well i hope it is rejuvenated because i don't like doing player v player...i like player v comp and it's more fun with two players or more against comps.  it's always more exciting when your not alone.....

What do you mean by "Game Days"?

I will certainly play Entrenchment online, unless the new strategies cause the game to be very drawn out and not fun anymore.  And Phalnax811 has a great point in that many people like to play cooperatively with their friends, so I think they will be playing Entrenchment online too.  There are many people who log in to continue cooperative Epic length games, and I think this will make up fair chunk of online players.   The multiplayer online community wants more content and strategies just as much as the singleplayer  My only fear is in large 4v4 or 5v5 games, everyone will just build a battlestation and turtle, and it will take forever to kill off the other team.  We'll see. 

Looking forward to it.  I am still waiting for "fight the Developers" day.

Not sure what you have in mind, but I'd love to see you guys promote the online multiplayer part of the game.

I'm with Cykur on this one.  Hack and I called this a while back.  Devs vs DT!  or just anything, I just want to do some dev stomping

RE 'games day events'; excellent I think this is really needed.

As for the comment RE expansion packs; once I've seen the content of them I may purchase them as a bundle, if they are ever released as such. ATM and as single items I just don't see the value in them particularly given the original intent on releasing some of this content for free.

For the sake of the multiplayer community, I just hope that either myself or others are correct otherwise we will see the multiplayer community fragment; that is either most get the expansion pack or most don't...I think any halfway point would be disasterous for the multiplayer community.

It was really fun playing with you yesterday, Frogboy!

Ahh yes, I would take great pleasure in attacking a dev or mod ingame to quell my frustrations with the design choices. Perhaps a quick defeat via a rush of some sort to really rub salt in to the wounds, followed by a quote from a few years back including the words 'rushing', 'will not bepossible', 'game design intent', 'the game we are making will...' 

Devs vs DT + Hack since I called helped call it

I guess it could be Devs vs DT if Hack was in DT, but since I'm not, DT + Hack vs Devs is the way to go

I bet you get your butt handed to you from rushing them

Nah, not if I make sure to choose the map and settings we play with

If we could get the devs to play more then maybe it would be easier to convince them of the need to have auto-downloading for custom maps.  (Now that you guys are done working on 1.1...if you have some spare time...)

Alternatively, I wonder if it might be possible for them to accept submissions for online multiplayer quality maps that could be made standard and included in future patches.

I noticed there were more maps in 1.1, including a new random type - medium large to sit between medium and large...

So, how is the multiplayer these days? Are there any activity?

There's activity but a little less than there was before 1.1 came out.  Come join us and they'll be one more player.  Best bets are European and North American prime time, say 2 pm U.S. Eastern Standard time to Midnight.

I think Entrenchment is the big chance if IC and the community play it right. Sins got excellent reviews, it already sold a big number of copies, and apparently it's the IC/Stardock line to keep their games alive for YEARS with expansions, patches and the like.

And maybe that strategy works. There is always a little rush of new/old players when a new expansion comes out. I dunno if there are now more people playing because of the holidays (I am) but comparing with the numbers Ke5strel quotes, I'm actually seeing slightly larger counts of people online. So that's very positive in the sense that even with all the past problems, Sins online is not going anywhere - the MP in most games just dies well before they reach 1 year, not to mention the space 4x genre where it might never get even started!

There is a huge pool of potential MPers out there, and IC/SD could capitalize on it by promoting the MP side more, especially when they already have the media attention with the mini-expansion. Some care should be taken to make the MP more accomodating, eg. make sure there are games available that don't take hours and hours, since people have less time available in MP, they can't just save and load later. Players could easily go the route SP-> co-op online -> MP -> clanned MP, if the MP side is promoted and clans/community take care to integrate any new players. Clans and MP is what keeps many games alive, and wins publicity & mindshare for the developer - this is an opportunity for IC/SD!

Some small developers are already putting a LOT of effort into making custom maps official, take a look at World in Conflict for example, they are doing a splendid job there! And yeah, the thing with automatically downloaded custom maps/mods is usually that they are several megs, so who organizes the d/l servers and bandwith, plus it takes time... But Sins maps are like <10 kB each, WTH IC?

In the fast few days I have noticed higher player counts and an infusion of new players, but I think it's based more on Christmas and the GOTY awards than Entrenchment.  The Entrenchment beta needs to get fixed soon so that people can play both Entrenchment and v1.12 with a single install.

All of that having been said, I still think that something is going to have to be done on the part of Stardock and/or Ironclad to revitalize the online multiplayer game for the long haul.  The minidumps, desyncs, and hosting issues still need work and somehow we have to take this mass of single player people and get them to come online, even if it's only to play against AI with other people.  Perhaps that aspect of the online game needs to be pushed and advertised somehow--come online and play against hte computer with human teammates--come join the party.

Yes, somebody has to make a bit of noise about Sins being an exciting multiplayer game. Promotion by IC/SD can go a long way in this. But somehow one needs to get around the impression that Sins is just another space 4x game, because the timescale approaches that... and space 4x hasn't really been a multiplayer success, just because of the time scale.

About co-op, perhaps it should be a bit more canonized. It's a valid and fairly common activity - I've played at least 3 co-op games over my hitherto short MP career in Sins - but for new players it might be a bit difficult to find co-op games. Maybe we could flag all our co-op games "C-O" or something like that, or IC could allow you to set your game as a co-op, and then it would automatically assign humans and AI into 2 opposing locked teams.