Wow ... the diplomacy really makes this game impossible, doesn't it?

I agree. Diplomacy needs to be tweaked. Missions need to be a tad bit more realistic in their approach as to what the player can be expected to accomplish. That and the AI needs to beat on itself a bit more rather than ganging up on the human player solely.

I play locked teams because of this... Diplomacy needs a serious looking at... Thankfully though the game is good enough that it's fun with a FFA or X vs X locked game.

you probably didn't lock the teams... its a very important option you select before creating the game... with the teams locked and the AI's each on different teams they likely won't gang up on you

While I agree that the diplomacy needs to be changed, I just won my first 4 player game against 3 normal AIs (after 2 previously unsuccessful attempts due to AI gang-ups as you described) by working the diplomacy. The first few runs through I neglected to do the missions, and all that did was make the AI mad at me.

The secret the 3rd time was to ingratiate the AI to me, largely through doing the 'Give me resources' missions. I allied with 2 different AI's along the way, and not once did I get ganged-up on by the AI. In fact I wasn't even attacked by AI (except for the pirates) until about 3 hours in. I won that game in about 4 hours.

I do think that the diplomacy options are too minimal, and are all one-way in nature, and need to be changed. But I now believe that proper use of the diplomacy will keep you in the game for a long time.

I understand what you are saying ... but isn't it a coin toss whether your diplomacy efforts will work? I mean if it gives you three missions in a row that you can't actually do - all your efforts go up in flames, no?

Dan

Yet sadly diplomacy is the only thing that gives any kind of challenge to the game. I found locked teams FFA way too easy so far.

Actually each AI faction will only give you one mission at a time. What you need to do is strategize which ones you want to do, based on the AI's strength, the ease of accomplishing the mission, and their prexisting hostility towards you.

My rule of thumb was to pretty much do all the 'Give me XXXX number of credit/metal/crystal' missions and very selectively choose which 'Destroy x number of faction y units" I did. Honestly, the loss of resources was more than made up by the AI allies that I earned later in the game. And at one point, I had all of them at greater than 50% 'friendliness' to me.

The AI in this game STINKS and BLOWS.

Default at war is one thing - but absolutely nothing I do can generate peace. I used to enjoy the "peaceful option" in Gal Civ & Gal Civ 2 - apparently in the move to a more RTS like game, Stardock has decided to punish anyone that doesn't want to spend the whole game fighting.

Well, This game is weighted very heavily towards the rts side and not much toward the 4x side. I think of it as about 95%/5%.

which of the fours x's stand for diplomacy? not just in this game but any game?

I see the point about there not being a peaceful resolution. In my game, it came down to me and my ally being the only ones left, and the allegiance between us was at 100%.

As soon as our last common enemy fell the ai was like, "well, looks like we have to fight this out" and broke our allegiance. too bad for him, because I mopped up the galaxy with him.

But in any case, there should be an option for ending the game at peace with one or more AI opponents.

An excellent point!

The "exploit" x could certainly include diplomacy. "Exploiting" a cease fire to gain advantage on another foe, for instance, or "exploiting" a trade agreement to earn some cred.

I haven't had any real problems with the diplomacy. In fact, I think it makes games vs multiple AIs easier.

The only thing that is odd is that you can have a trade agreement before a cease fire. It doesn't make much sense to me to be trading with someone who you are trying to damage/kill.

I dislike that the AI automatically starts out at war with them when you first meet them. It is difficult to build their trust if they already hate you.

starting at war fits in with the story. Since all the races are already supposed to be at war.

Trade Alliance just means they wont shoot your trade ships and your trade ships will go through there controlled areas to get somewhere over going a place that has enemies. so you can still shoot there ships just not there trade ships. so you don't actually trade with them.

I also think the diplomacy needs some tweaking I played a custom map and I allied with the AI in my star but all the other AI's wanted me to shoot my AI teammate by the time all the missions ran out all the other AI allied against me talk about a 1 sided match I didn't stand a chance 8 against 2 and it was mostly my planets under siege.

I cant't bear the diplomacy thing, so i play locked teams. The AI keep asking you to complete silly missions such as crush your own allies or attack a faction who's in a far away system! The diplomacy is a crap and it has so little options (8!). A faction is an ally if you're completing missions for it ant you cannot give other's missions! I can't believe such a marvellous game as such a stupid diplomacy system! Please Stardock react! I've read posts from Stardock justifying the diplomacy, I can understand they deliver a great game with such a flaw, but I can't believe they are not going to greatly improve it!

Don't worry, this should be fixed with the upcoming expansion.

YAH a necro!

LOL yeah!  I don't recognize any of the names here as currently active forum members.

ha, wat names r u looking for?

I was thinking the same about your name.

Nothing beats a good haunting

well i was playing sins of an solar empire and i had an glitch when the game started all of the allies that where mine where actually at war with me though i could see them and make trade routes with them... kinda (teams where locked) so i was  running from an unstoppable parade of ships that can attack me but i cant them. THATS an diplomency problem for you.

Why cant the enemies ally each other... not that i would liek them to but still,

AIs DO form alliances with each other... you just don't know about it until you figure it out (like their ships not attacking each other, etc).

I know right...but this game is easy for me even with like 3 armadas attacking me,i got a nice litle starbase waiting for them though .