Torinak Torinak

After 20 hours, I give up...the UI wins.

After 20 hours, I give up...the UI wins.

I've spent about 20 hours playing the UI of Galactic Civilizations, and have come to the conclusion that the UI has beat me--it has successfully kept me from playing the game underneath it. The collection of major and minor annoyances and UI quirks as manifested in the current version have kept me from feeling like I'm playing a game, despite many efforts to try to work around and/or ignore them. I have high hopes that these issues may be addressed in future patches, but until then, I just can't play GalCiv. :(

I've listed my major issues below. Most of them could be addressed by adding tool-tip and/or clickable context-sensitive help to the UI; doing so would go a loooong way in making the UI more palatable. If there are ways of addressing any of the issues below with the current GalCiv UI, I would appreciate any suggestions...I really really want to be able to play GalCiv!

In rough order of decreasing annoyance, the issues I've found are:

* Cannot get details on technologies while in diplomacy screen.

* Cannot tell what projects, ships, etc., that result from techs do from tech screen, or the planet details screen.

* Cannot get details on projects, ships, etc., from planet view (F7) without selecting the alternatives, which changes what's being built.

* Cannot get details on what already-built trade goods do, either yours or those built by others.

* Cannot see trade routes on mini-map, or main map.

* It is possible to launch colony ships w/out ever getting the dialog to load them, resulting in an empty ship with no way to load it, and no indication that you've done something wrong.

* Mini-map views are always at least several keystrokes/mouse clicks away when they need to be visible at all times. For example, when adding to a starbase or building on a planet, its location with respect to everything else is important, yet is not easy to see w/out several clicks.

* Very few screens have any sort of useful tool-tip or other methods to get more information about what's going on. IMO, every single field, icon, UI component, and displayed bit of information should have tool-tip help.

* The 3-way money allocation sliders are highly cumbersome for what they do, and don't present what they're doing very well. A triangular selector would be a lot more obvious, I think--it would immediately show that you're dividing up allocation between three fields.

* Quantity selection sliders in the game are very unpleasant to use. At a minimum, it should be possible to type in a quantity directly instead of having to click hundreds of times.

* There is no way to see what's contributing toward the total income and expenses of your empire, or of a given planet. For example, it would be nice to know how many of a given type of building you have, empire-wide, and to get a quick breakdown of all costs associated with a specific planet.

* There is no way to jump directly to a planet that has completed one project if its governor has automatically started another one.

* The planet list window (F2) only shows 7 planets at a time, and is cumbersome to use to sort displays (many clicks to change what the sort field is).

* It is very hard to tell who owns starbases on the main map window. The colored shading on the starbases is very subtle, especially between dark green and dark blue, at least on every monitor and set of lighting conditions, contrast, etc., that I've tried. An option to make the ownership more obvious would be helpful.

* There is no legend for the tactical screen, nor can anything on it be selected or interrogated. Even basic tool-tip info about what the cursor is hovering over would be a big improvement.

* There is no way to get a list of all know planets in the galaxy, or all uncolonized ones, or all owned by a certain race, etc.

* There is no legend for the meaning of the miniature icons next to ships in the ship list (F3), or for the icons next to planets in the main window.

* Some things that can be clicked on give no visible indication that they can (e.g., clicking "Military Projects" or "Social Projects" in the planet view window to see details of the current project in that category), and others that look like they can be clicked on cannot be (e.g., some of the widgets in the Economics window, the button-shaped empty outlines in the Diplomacy window)

* There are numerous issues with focus that cause confusion. For example, I have had one ship selected (I think!) and right-clicking caused a different one to move. I have had the "Do you want to upgrade this starbase?" dialog pop up while looking at the research screen, and I have no idea why it did, or where the starbase was.

* Launching ships is a multi-step process. If I see that a new ship has been built (from the start-of-turn summary), and auto-launch isn't enabled for the corresponding planet, I have to hunt down the non-launched ship in the ship list and then click on it, then click the "launch" button, or double-click on it (which can be bad if I'm just trying to select it to get more info, not send it into space). If I have auto-launch enabled, and the ship is a transport/colony ship, I have to hunt down the planet to see its details before I can make an informed decision as to how to load it.

* There are no per-planet planetary build queues. Having the governor build queues directly accessable from the per-planet planet view/build menu can create the impression that the per-governor queue is per-planet, when it isn't.

* At one point, the UI style changed for no apparent reason, and there wasn't any way to change it back. The UI style should be an option from main menu.

* There is no information about the options in the main menu. Tool-tip or other forms of help information would be useful.

* The mini-map zoom factor box in the upper-right corner is always active, even when the mini-map is not visible.

I would be happy to discuss any of the above in more detail, and/or to provide more suggestions if desired.

-Torinak
1,244 views 35 replies
Reply #26 Top
I absolutely slammed Civ3 when it came out with that godawful tech tree that was just four screen shots shrunken down to where you couldn't even read the detail text.

In that vein, I do believe that GalCiv deserves criticism for its lack of a fold-out tech tree. I don't think it's unreasonable to expect something like this to be included with a $45 game.

Yes, I am fully aware that there is a fansite with a tech tree.
Reply #27 Top
I agree fully with Torinak's post. Hopefully, Brad will just print this list out and prioritize it for his interface team--it's a damned-near comprehensive account of all the UI problems.

~SDC~
Reply #28 Top
Try playing a game with a shockly bad UI like M003 and come back to Galciv and you will never bother complaining again :)
Reply #29 Top
Well, if you would like stuff documented (such as what buttons do what, what can be clicked, what the icons are, etc etc..), make certain to hit the main page and add your comments to the 'manual' thread. They are making an updated manual.. woot!!! Make sure you tell 'em what you would like to see in it!!

fleabitfox
Reply #30 Top
Galciv is a good game that can stand criticism, and I think the original post had a lot of points. To me, personally, the locking slider on the spending ratios would be peachy. I can overlook the little things elsewhere pretty good, but for some reason, having to play with the sliders for 30 seconds to get the exact balance I want is a little annoying. Overall, though, this is not only a good game, but the team is actively trying to improve it on a constant basis. A devoted team and a supportive user community are exactly what the doctor ordered to keep Galciv a hummin'.

Do not take this as an outright MOO bash or anything, but to use MOO 3 as an example of how not to do things, if the MOO 3 team put in as much effort as the MOO 3 modders in improving their game, they wouldn't have half the perception of MOO 3 being seen as a shoddy piece of work. But, for the record, I blame evil marketing people from a big company for forcing MOO 3 onto the market before it was time. If it was allowed more time without being pressured, I am sure it would have been a great game right out of the box. And if it was a better game right from the start, then the team over there would not have had to dig into defensive positions and cower in the foxholes in the face of overwhelming fire (complaints) while slowly trying to patch the product.
Reply #31 Top
GalCiv could use some interface polishing.

I've experienced the problem of being asked what module to build on a starbase, well the main screen (and side list) were busy displaying other things. I've had the Technology screen blocking the main, the diplomacy list (due to having just "sold" or gifted my last 'manual' ship to an AI), and even the planet screen. It happens. Generally, I've had a good idea which base it was, thanks to the modules already present/built but...

I think the 'list of planets of (whatever)' is not meant to be a full list from the start. Merely a list of already known/discovered.

GalCiv has some issues. But these are generally mere warts or pimples, IMO. If Star Dock addresses them, I will be very happy, but it isn't a show stopper to me.
Reply #32 Top
* There is no way to get a list of all know planets in the galaxy, or all uncolonized ones, or all owned by a certain race, etc.

I'd settle for just being able to see a list of the PQ15+ planets in systems I've already colonised instead of having to go visit each system or keep notes.

I agree with many of the other interface comments here as well, and I'll bet we'll see Brad use it as a UI wishlist.
Reply #33 Top
Bobo like all suggestions.
But Bobo also say, Bobo can play game and win game (him smart)right now. If Frogman make game better with good ideas maybe find things easier, maybe not. Bobo still win game if try hard. Bobo only lose when Bobo not know how to win. Or not try.
Bobo feel bad for people who lose because
dont like interface. Bobo feel real bad. Him almost cry now.
OK. Bobo feel better.
Now Bobo play game.
Reply #34 Top
Just bumping this back to the top, the original post is brilliant, these issues need addressing by the developers.
Reply #35 Top
All those that he mentioned have workarounds. See that ? in the corner of a project build. Tells you everything you need to know. Granted, I don't use governors to build. They have a habit of being ignorant of new projects added to the build project list.

The major annoyance I see is when I route a 50 or so ships to 34 different spots on the map and 23 of the ships are intercepted. They don't continue on their path after erradicating the obstacle. An Excalibur shouldn't even have to stop to take on a star fighter.

The other annoyance is when you build a starbase and it disappears from the map. I have 6 of them and not one shows up on the mini-map.

Al