July 20th 2004
Marys Disorder and some Facts
from 
JoeUser Forums
JoeUser Forums
So heres a little back ground and info on Mary and her disorder. First Mary was born on july 26th 1999 at 36 weeks gestation it was a normal delivery up untill she entered the world I waited to hear her cry but she didnt the doctors and nurses all ran out of the room with her and I was left wondering if my baby was even alive. after a while I went to the NICU to see what was up and the doctors there told me that when Mary enterd the world she was in the middle of a gran-mal seizure and had 5 consectutive gran-mal seizures after that, I asked if she would make it and they were sure she would they watched her for a few days and she didnt have anymore seizures the suspected they were caused by a nurse who forgot to chart a pain shot she had given me and a few minutes after that shot i got an epidural the figured the drugs were so strong that they reached Mary and caused her Seizures they sent her home and said she was in great health. Things were ok for a few days untill one day while watching mary she turned as white as a sheet of printing paper and began to jerk all over from head to toe,I call the doctor right away and he said she was most likely hasing a tremor which was normal in a newborn ( i had never heard of it) so i accepted it ) untill the episodes continued for a few weeks daily eventually i found a good Dr named Dr Mclelon(spelling)maybe wrong) and he agreed mary was in fact seizing I told him that my father had seizures also but i didnt know much about him so i didnt know what caused his
they did an MRI and found no cause for Marys seizures and diagnosed her with Epilepsy so life went on as mary got older she also had phocal seizures (were she would stare blankly into space you could clap stomp yell and scream) she could see or hear anything. around about 3 months I noticed mary changeing little by little she no longer could be held and cuddled by anyone my grandmother or nanny as i call her tired my mother tired everyone mary would just scream to the top of her lung this is about the same time Mary began sleeping less and less, I can remeber sitting up night after night just trying to rock her to sleep i would get her quiet try and lay her down and she would begin screaming again (this is also the same time i was pregnant with my son Noah) I called the doctors and they said collic I just had to wait it out and so I tried day in and day out no sleep just non stop crying no matter what and man she hated to be held. some how i survived those time and loved mary all the way through.
as you can guess by now i was starting to doubt every doctor i talked to something in my heart was telling me mary was diffrent and not like all the other babies at 6 months i started trying to help mary by laying on her stomach and letting her play but she didnt like that she preferd her back i notcied she couldnt focus on toys would try and scoot to them and couldnt roll over I thought well its becuase she is a premature baby but by the time she was 9 months old and still doing none of the above i took her to Dr mclelon again the one i knew would help and that is when he told mary had what is call Infintile Autisum and that she may possibly out grown it so i waited mary still wasnt sleeping at all and crying all the time on july 22nd 2000 i went into labor with my son Noah 4 days before mary was to turn one by then she had began to roll over and sccot but no walking and no talking yet and still crying and now i had 3 babies at home My oldest is jessie she is now 7 but was going on 3 at the time my son was born mary was 1 year old and now a new born jessie was easy to handle with mary she has always been a wonderfuly smart child and always able to entertian herself but wow a new born with mary that was hard times luckily Noah slept well with out being rocked or held and he always seemed to smile from the day he was born but i also had to change diapers for two kids and feed two kids a bottle and hold and carry two kids (i remeber everyone in the apts i lived in talking about me carring mary in my arms Noah in a car seat and trying to hold jessies hand while I walked to my moms or grand mothers) it was a site but het it was also exersice.
when mary was 15months old and Noah was 3 months old i made a hard choice i left my husband for personal reason i told my self I could do all this alone and didnt need him and to some extent that was true because he had and i do say had a temper that caused us to seperate i lived by myself for about a month with 3 kids alone one 3 month old who was eating every four hrs and one 15 month old who couldnt walk or talk and never slept.so i talked to my husband and told him he needed to get help for his temper and that if he did i would move to idah o(i couldnt do it alone after all) it got to the point that i was starting to resent mary i couldnt spend time with my new baby couldnt leave her alone for 2 sec and could be alone by myself at all with out crying i felt so stressed and over whelmed by it all and not to many people know this but when i found out i was pregnant with noah i almost didnt keep him (i dont believe in abortion) by i was considering adoption i even talked to my mother about her takeing him...the only reason i didnt is a promise i made to god I asked god to give me a healthy pregnacy and a baby boy and i would o my best to raise this baby with all the love i had god accepted my promise and i kept it i love mary and noah and my other two babies jessie and bethany with all my heart and sould no matter how much anyone tells me im crazy or that my kids are bad they are mine so keep bad comments to yourself.
anyway back to the story,at 15 months old i told marys doctor i couldnt do it any more and that i need help and rest so he put mary on her first tranqulizer hahaha that was a joke i remeber he told me it would knock her out in about 10 mins 20 if she fought it well let me tell you she fought it allllll night long she still didnt sleep i knwo the stuff smelled like pure moonshine and tasted like it as well so i had to mix it in a sippy cup and sneek it to her.....mary might have been a lot of things but she wasnt dump she caught on real quick she began to refuse the cup at all,heres a funny story abotu that one night I slipped mary medication in her cup and just left it laying there like i hadnt touched it i forgot that my oldest jessie was there playing well jessie decide she was thristy and wanted her sisters cup jessie drank that stuff right down and for about an hr that lil girl laughed and stubled and played she was so tired and drunk it just cracked me up she would fall down and just laugh and laugh ( jessie has always had a nack for makeing me laugh)after that i quit useing that medication and went back to no sleep.my husband got some help from his parents to get treatment for his temper and get on some meds i moved to idaho in oct of 2000 it was the hardest choice i ever made and i still spend most days wondering if it was the right one.when mary was 18 months old she began to hurt her self when she got mad she would pull her own hair so hard it would just fall out and she wouldbite her self so hard she would leave brusies she couldnt seem to control her temper and i eventual had to resort to holding therapy to keep her safe from her self o had by the way she finnaly started walking at 18 months but still the only word she could say was dada she was always a daddies girl and still is to this day.things continued to go this way for ever it seems me always struggleing to understand and spending most days wondering why mary hated me it seemed but i finnaly reached a breaking point when mary turned 2 she no longer hurt herself when mad she hurt anything and anyone in her way she began to just walk up and hit her brother for no aparent reason i would send her to her room and she would scream this high pitch scream that could have broken a window she would throw toys up against the wall tear her bed apart shred every piec of paper she could find and this would go on for about 30 mins and then silance ( i use to tell everyone when mary was in what we now know is a psycotic state that it seemed her eyes had no soul they were just black and empty) mary began screaming her hated me and wanted me to go away.If i aked mary if she wanted to eat she would say no then as i tucked her in she would scream im hungery to the top of her lungs if i asked if she wanted to go to the park it was no but then two minutes later she would scream at me i want to go to the park now you could never ask mary to do a simple thing like clean your room or pick up that toy she is very violent she has picked up full size kitchen chairs and thrown them at me just because i asked her to put something away she has punched me in the face and given me brusies becuase i told her no about something and lets face it if she had been 20 years old and done it i could have swung back but what do you do with a two year old that this powerful...... i finally found a dr here in idhao that listened to my problems and helped with out thinking i was crazy Dr.pines is his name had we have been with him for 3 years now i finnaly found him one day when marys violnce got out of control it happened like this
mary and noah had gone out in the back yard to play and all was great they played in their pool and played with bikes the phone rang inside and i went to grab it it took all of 60secounds when i got back in the back yeard mary was sitting on top of noah who was only 1 at the time she had her hand over his noase and mouth and was laughing i jerked her off noah and wanted so much to spank her but didnt out of fear instead i cried like a baby.Why was my baby this way how could she be so mean and hateful what had anyone of us done to her mary and i had a fight that day that you would of thought was going on between adults i asked her to go to her room while i calmed down she immediately said no you go to your room and started picking up toys first small ones and then as i insited she go to her room the bigger one one was a big hug tonka dump truck made out of metal and then the kitchen chairs and then that wasnt enough she started swinging as hard as she could at me (and when i say she has power while in this state i mean she can hit like goldberg) all i could do was cry i finally took mary by force into her room and propted a chair under the knob so she couldnt get out man she destored that room that day it lasted about 2 hrs that day non stop screaming and throwing and just unbelieveable force.i picked up the phonebook and said a prayer that god would help me find some one who could help my little girl .....and he did thank god see i wasnt mad that day more hurt i couldnt understand where that angel i brought into the world was she was now so cold and unloveing and mean i didnt understand and most days still dont.
so there some history on Mary now on to her diagnosis of O.D.D (Oppositional Definat Disorder) you are either saying one of two things right now the first is most likely "i wish that would have been my child,i would beat her butt" or two "What caused this girl to be this way" well Im gonna tell you and if you think your child has any of this please call and ask for help its easy to get out of control.
O.D.D
Oppositional Defiant Disorder (ODD)
What is it?
ODD is a psychiatric disorder that is characterized by two different sets of problems. These are aggressiveness and a tendency to purposefully bother and irritate others. It is often the reason that people seek treatment. When ODD is present with ADHD, depression, tourette's, anxiety disorders, or other neuropsychiatric disorders, it makes life with that child far more difficult. For Example, ADHD plus ODD is much worse than ADHD alone, often enough to make people seek treatment. The criteria for ODD are:
A pattern of negativistic, hostile, and defiant behavior lasting at least six months during which four or more of the following are present:
1. Often loses temper
2. often argues with adults
3. often actively defies or refuses to comply with adults' requests or rules
4. often deliberately annoys people
5. often blames others for his or her mistakes or misbehavior
6. is often touchy or easily annoyed by others
7. is often angry and resentful
8. is often spiteful and vindictive
The disturbance in behavior causes clinically significant impairment in social, academic, or occupational functioning.
How often is "often"?
All of the criteria above include the word "often". But what exactly does that mean? Recent studies have shown that these behaviors occur to a varying degree in all children. These researchers have found that the "often" is best solved by the following criteria.
Has occurred at all during the last three months-
8. is spiteful and vindictive
5. blames others for his or her mistakes or misbehavior
Occurs at least twice a week
6. is touchy or easily annoyed by others
1. loses temper
2. argues with adults
3. actively defies or refuses to comply with adults' requests or rules
Occurs at least four times per week
7. is angry and resentful
4. deliberately annoys people
What causes it?
No one knows for certain. The usual pattern is for problems to begin between ages 1-3. If you think about it, a lot of these behaviors are normal at age 2, but in this disorder they never go away. It does run in families. If a parent is alcoholic and has been in trouble with the law, their children are almost three times as likely to have ODD. That is, 18% of children will have ODD if the parents are alcoholic and the father has been in trouble with the law.
How can you tell if a child has it?
ODD is diagnosed in the same way as many other psychiatric disorders in children. You need to examine the child, talk with the child, talk to the parents, and review the medical history. Sometimes other medical tests are necessary to make sure it is not something else. You always need to check children out for other psychiatric disorders, as it is common the children with ODD will have other problems, too.
Who gets it?
A lot of children! This is the most common psychiatric problem in children. Over 5% of children have this. In younger children it is more common in boys than girls, but as they grow older, the rate is the same in males and females.
ODD rarely travels alone
It is exceptionally rare for a physician to see a child with only ODD. Usually the child has some other neuropsychiatric disorder along with ODD. The tendency for disorders in medicine to occur together is called comorbidity. Understanding comorbidity in pediatric psychiatry is one of the most important areas of research at this moment.
Common patterns of comorbidity
ODD plus ADHD
If a child comes to a clinic and is diagnosed with ADHD, about 30-40% of the time the child will also have ODD Here are some Recent research suggests that all things being equal, girls with ODD plus ADHD have significantly worse social problems than boys with ODD plus ADHD
What happens to children who have this when they grow up?
There are three main paths that a child will take.
First, there will be some lucky children who outgrow this. The exact number is not clear, but probably not the majority. The aggressiveness is very stable. That is, aggressive 2 year olds are likely to be aggressive 20 year olds. Only IQ is more stable over years than aggression.
Second, ODD may turn into conduct disorder (CD). This usually happens fairly early. That is, after a 3-4 years of ODD, if it hasn't turned into CD, it won't ever. What predicts a child with ODD getting CD? A history of a biologic parent who was a career criminal, and very severe ODD.
Third, the child may continue to have ODD. Recent work suggests that this is probably the most common path. If you look at a group of preschool boys who have ODD and check them out two years later, about 75% still have something wrong. Sometimes ODD at that age changes into something else, but that is rare. More often ADHD and ODD just continue on. The more common thing that happens is that children with ODD develop signs of mood disorders or anxiety as they get older. By the time these children are in the end of elementaryschool, about 25% will have mood or anxiety problems which are disabling. That means that it is very important to watch for signs of mood disorder and anxiety as children with ODD grow older.
Will children with ODD end up as criminals?
Probably not unless they develop conduct disorder ( see below) Even then many will grow out of it. Life may not be easy. People with ODD who are grown up often do best if they can work for themselves and stay away from alcohol. However their tendency to irritate others often leads to a lonely life.
What is the difference between ODD and ADHD?
ODD is characterized by aggressiveness, but not impulsiveness. In ODD people annoy you purposefully, While it is usually not so purposeful in ADHD. ODD signs and symptoms are much more difficult to live with than ADHD. ADHD sometimes goes away, but ODD rarely does. ODD is not characterized by poor social skills. Children with ODD can sit still.
What difference does it make if you have ADHD or ADHD plus ODD?
A lot! Children and adolescents with ADHD alone do things without thinking, but not necessarily aggressive things. An ADHD child may impulsively push someone too hard on a swing and knock the child down on the ground. She would likely be sorry she did this afterward. A child with ODD plus ADHD might push the kid out of the swing and say she didn't do it, and then brag about it to her friends later. ADHD plus ODD children and adolescents are in a lot of trouble as their impulsiveness and hyperactivity often lead to fights, rough play, and huge temper tantrums.
My child has been diagnosed with ODD. I don't like to say this, but no one can stand him. Is this common?
Unfortunately, it is quite common. In comparison to ADHD alone, children and adolescents with ODD plus ADHD or just ODD are much more difficult to be with. The destructiveness and disagreeableness are purposeful. They like to see you get mad. Every request can end up as a power struggle. Lying becomes a way of life, and getting a reaction out of others is the chief hobby. Perhaps hardest of all to bear, they rarely are truly sorry and often believe nothing is their fault. After a huge blow up, the child with ODD is often calm and collected. It is the parents who look as they are going to lose it, not the child. This is understandable. The parents have probably just been tricked, bullied, lied to or have witnessed temper tantrums which know no limits.
My father in law says the whole problem is my husband and I. My daughter convinced him that she is a victim of uncaring parents. How often does this happen?
Too often! Children and adolescents with ODD produce strong feelings in people. They are trying to get a reaction out of people, and they are often successful. Common ones are: inciting spouses to fight with each other and not focus on the child, making outsiders believe that all the fault lies with the parents, making certain susceptible people believe that they can "save" the child by doing everything the child wants, setting parents against grandparents, setting teachers against parents, and inciting the parents to abuse the child. I frequently see children with ODD in which teachers and parents and sometimes others are all fighting amongst each other rather than with the child who is causing all the turmoil in the first place.
this is what we have found on this disorder and we hope and pray we can learn more as time goes its very hard mary is now on medications includeing risperdal,trazadone,clonidine,and concerta,but even these dont help much mary still has fits of rage just two weeks ago her brother noah climbed on the top bunk of marys bed this realled made her mad for some reason and she put her hand around noahs throat and began chokeing him while banging his head up and down on the bed i literally had to peel mary off him noah had bruises on his neck for days ,yes this is a very scary way of life trying to guess at what she will be mad at next of what will set her off but even though i get stressed and so do my other children i love mary and i pray that one day she will overcome this mostly i think about the fact that because of mary problem i have no friends no one can stand marys outburst and temper most of everyone i know has request i dont go to thir house with mary there i dont like to go at all its worse because these people dont understand how much it hurts that they cant see the good in mary and trust me there is and i promise to tell you all those stories to but i want other people to know my child is not mean or evil or even bad she does have a problem but dont we all,i just want mary to be treated like every grandchild like every niece or nephew or every playmate dont judge her shes to young to understand why she is pushed away and its not fair to me or my family
hope you learned a little here and ill try and keep up
thanks dianne