I'll work on Ships after I get down with Techs. As far as copyright issues go, Desert Fox sounds like he knows what he's talking about.

~SDC~

Great work HawaiiFive-O! I can't wait to try your program. Unfortunately I won't have time before the weekend.

What about the metaverse? Is there some guideline of what you can add without being considered a cheater when you submit to the metaverse?
An additional SB module would be available to the AI as well but would it recognize and use it?

Markus: Unfortunately, none of us really know at what point a mod renders your game illegal for the Metaverse. You are right the AI is "smart" enough to make use of any mods you add (see Stardock's improving the AI to make use of un-balancing Political Parties in 1.03), but the question is what affect the mod has on your Metaverse score.

If you are really concerned about your Metaverse standing, I'd suggest holding off until we get official word from Stardock as to what is legal and what is not.

As for me, the Metaverse holds no attraction. You should see some of the crazy stuff I play with.

~SDC~

Thanks. I will try some mods anyway and don't submit those games to the Metaverse.
It would be nice if they integrate some mod support into the game so that you could select a set of rules when you start the game. Then the game could even submit the score if you played standard rules or just the game data for improving the AI if diferrent rules were used. Maybe they do something like that in the expansion pack.
How do you manage your mods? By saving and restoring the data directory?

Hey, HawaiiFive-O, I just tried to install the general public version and it didn't work. I got to the part where it has the default install directory, C:\GalCivWriter I think it was, and it wouldn't install. It said that directory was in the source directory of setup.

I then unzipped to some random directory in C and it worked fine.

Apparently you just can't run setup from your C drive or else it won't have anywhere you can install.

The Writer has two built-in functions I use manage the data directory.

The first is the Backup Data Directory function (Main screen>>Tools>>Backup Data Directory). This'll make a wholesale copy of your \Data directory. It can take a bit if you've got a bunch of saved games.

The second, which I don't think is in the public version (yet) is Data File Management (Main screen>>File>>Data File Management). This one creates a holding directory in the installation directory and allows you to rotate mods in and out. I use this when I'm testing stuff. It's pretty handy.

~SDC~

William: That's odd. It will give that message if you try to install into the same directory you copied the install package down to. IOW, if you downloaded the package into C:\Temp, and then attempted to install into C:\Temp, it would get that message.

Did you copy the install package into C:\GalCivWriter and then run setup from there? That would cause the message you saw.

If not, weird how it got confused.

Typically, you'd download it somewhere else and then install it to C:\GalCivWriter, the Setup program will build the directory automatically.

~SDC~

For what it is worth, CDG will be creating a Galactic Civ Hall of Fame exclusively for modded games. We may also include regular game postings as well, maybe list the scores as modded and unmodded games. We may even create Empire names for accumulating scores much the same (no where as good of course) as the Metaverse does. We will also hold gaming competitions to determine who really is the best player in the world. We do this for the modding community mainly, not in no way to compete with SDC current metaverse. Anyone visiting CDG will realize we fully support GC, SDC and especially Frogboy. My favorite executive of any business I have ever been in contact with. Maybe Frogboy will grace the pages of CDG GC forums one day. (Hopefully anyways) I know, "he keeps plugging the website" Sorry my excitement gets me carried away!

~SDC~

The new version with Tech editing has gone out to the testers. I'll work on Ships next.

But I've got a little design issue that I'm having trouble deciding how to fix, so I thought I'd solicit advice here.

SB Modules:
Currently, I don't allow you to renumber IDs within the program. The reasons for this are several, 1) SB Modules must be contiguous. If you leave a gap in the numbering the modules after the gap won't work. 2) You don't want to have multiple modules with the same ID, as when one is built, all the modules with the same ID get built as well.

As it stands now, the Writer will automatically resolve 1 and 2 above by removing any gaps and resolving any ID conflicts upon load.

But should I unlock that field and allow you to renumber the modules as you see fit? 'Course if you leave a gap your modules won't work. I actually had this functionality working prior to finding out that modules have to be contiguous.

I did it this way because while the "expert" user might chafe at this limitation, it will keep the "casual" user out of harm's way. And the "expert" user probably knows enough to dive into Notepad and renumber the modules themselves. But I'm open to suggestions.

Oh, and I locked the Tech ID field down too, but I've reconsidered that move. It'll be open for editing in the next version. It'll test to make sure you aren't trying to use an existing ID first.

~SDC~

HF-0.... The Tech Editing screen seems to function fine, I haven't had a chance to produce anything yet, Just had some fun playing round and viewing the different techs.

I am wondering though, As you add functionality into the Writer with all the additional attributes to Mod, It would be quite handy to have an editing screen open for more than one type of Mod. At present it is possible to have multiple instances of the writer open, But this can be annoying when u are multitasking with other apps as well. What about a tabbed interface within the one window? Is this a fundamental 'not-possible' change?

Second idea is, While it is functional, I find it annoying when you loadup the Writer and it starts with the 'small' opening screen, then when u click on a section under edit, it jumps to large size. If you were to tab the interface and start it up at the full size, this would be VERY handy and functional... Maybe on the opening page you could fill the space with the 'file swapping' utility that is presently under the file menu and have a button that would automatically launch Galciv... So the Writer could double up as a Launcher/Modding Util.

Just thoughts anywayz, I figure thatz wot beta testers are for... And Thanx once again for the hard work you have put in. The Writer is in fantastic shape for an after-hours, unpaid, third party, developer like yourself.



~SDC~

On the (possibly unfounded) assumption that most users of GalCiv Writer will fall into the 'expert' category, my vote is to allow changing IDs within the program.

Could you include a default warning as part of the SBModule template? Something along the lines of:
"SB Modules must be contiguous. If you leave a gap in the numbering the modules after the gap won't work."

I suggest this because it's likely/possible that the average Mod downloader will have to change the ID to fit with his/her current configuration, anyway.

End transmission.

~SDC~

4D:
"It would be quite handy to have an editing screen open for more than one type of Mod."
- This is possible to code. Only real challenge is ensuring changes made in one screen updates the other, in the case Modules/Ships/Imps/InvTactics that are dependent on a tech. Oh, and making sure you close everything out before unloading the main screen.

"At present it is possible to have multiple instances of the writer open"
- I wouldn't recommend you do this. Simple reason is each instance of the program assumes it has exclusive access to the files. Making a change in one instance will not be communicated to the second instance. As long as you are aware that some weirdness could occur when you make a change in one instance that could break what the second instance is trying to do, I guess this is OK.

"What about a tabbed interface within the one window?"
- Had I thought of it prior to starting, this would have been no problem. At this stage of the game, it's pretty problematic to do.

"If you were to tab the interface and start it up at the full size, this would be VERY handy and functional"
- Unfortunately, while I agree this would be pretty cool, I'm too far gone into the other model- discrete screens for discrete functions, to effect this change. I'd basically have to rip out most of the code, add a tabbing mechanism (probably necessitating a new install package), and rather than being within 2 or 3 weeks of completion be back at square one. I think the best I can do at this point is allow multiple editing screens to be open at the same time.

"So the Writer could double up as a Launcher/Modding Util"
- You aren't the first to mention this. Its a possiblity. I'll take a look at this after I'm done with the base files.

"Just thoughts anywayz, I figure thatz wot beta testers are for... And Thanx once again for the hard work you have put in. The Writer is in fantastic shape for an after-hours, unpaid, third party, developer like yourself."
- Thanks! And thanks for the feedback. Had I thought of it at the start, it would have been just as easy to go with an MDI (multiple document interface) rather than the SDI (single document interface) I did. But I didn't think of it, primarily because I thought I was just writing an Event writer. I'll see what I can do about allowing multiple screens open at the same time.

Captain Bizarre:
After sleeping on it, I agree with you. I'll let the user change the IDs, and warn you if you leave a gap upon saving the modules.

~SDC~

HF-0,

Just had a look at the data File Management Screen. Great Idea, Could you expand on it maybe and allow the use of folders within the holding directory? (I mean custom user folders). This would allow users who were making a 'Star Trek' Mod for instance to have a folder with all the files neccesary for the Star Trek Mod and just swap them over with the standard files which get dumped into the standard folder for that gaming session.



~SDC~

That's the natural extension of that screen, isn't it? Let me take a look at it.

~SDC~

Thanks for the response to the last message... I missed it while writing my post. Having multiple files open will be good... Looking forward to seeing that in action.

~SDC~

I would say have auto-numbering on as default, but you can turn it off if you want. The user would then get a reminder that non-contiguous numbers will result in the file not working properly. When saving, if the user then leaves a gap, give the user a choice to renumber manually or have the application auto-renumber for you.

Bill

~SDC~

@ Citizen4D - There was something similar to that for Baldur's Gate II. When you installed a mod, you did it thru a front end, it took care of backing up the original files & such, when you wanted to play a normal game, you could revert it & the mod files would go to another folder so you could play the mod again when you wanted to.

Modding BG2 was a lot harder that GalCIv....

~SDC~

New beta version out to the testers.

Unlocked the ID fields.

Built out the Data File Management screen. You can now add folders and copy/move files around.

~SDC~

I also posted it on the front page of All Out Games, a site I do reviews for...

~SDC~

Cool! Thanks.

After kicking out this latest version, I'm left to ponder the question- program some more, or have a Jack and Coke? Or perhaps do both.

~SDC~

Good to see a developer drinking the 'real thing'.... Coke is the Software Designers/Graphic Artists Friend!

Thanks for adding the functionality to the Data File Management Screen, Should be very handy.



~SDC~

Maybe, but you don't have to know anything about computers to appreciate My Friend, Jack.

End transmission.

~SDC~

Well, that was pretty fast.

Ship editing 99% done. Just have to write the documentation. Oh, and sleep on a couple of decisions I made, might change my mind in the morning. There's some weirdness to the files, what with the Starbase, Decoration, and Space Shark entries. I tried to make it as open as possible while trying to keep you "within the lines".

This version should go out to the betas tomorrow. Here's a screenie:
http://www.ctuit.com/bill/ships.jpg

No pretty picture, as this screen isn't intended to allow you to edit the ship models in any way, just the stats.

What's left? Political Parties, Improvements, Invasion Tactics, Anomalies. I think I'll hit PolParties next. Improvements are going to be last, because they are going to be a PITA.

After that, I'm taking a break.

After the break, there's several things I can explore. Why not vote in this thread on where future development should take me?

1) Maybe some sort of ModSwapping function.

2) Perhaps a dynamic tech tree generator that'll read the files on your hard drive and create a .bmp on the fly. Then you'd have some handy documentation to give out with your "total conversion" mod.

3) I've also thought that parsing out the save game files (hex-based , but possible) would be pretty handy- then I could make a save game editor. From there we are just a short step away from a Map Editor and Scenarios. But Stardock's mentioned they might be adding this in the future, I don't really want to devote a lot of time to a project that'll be made obsolete.

4) Fulfill 4D's dream of multiple editing screens open at the same time. Perhaps restructure things and allow a tabbed interface. This'll definitely shrink the executable size, but I fear it's a good 3 to 4 week project. Don't want to think about rewriting the darn proggy right now.

5) Something else?

6) All of the above. Because you hate me and don't want me to have any free time ever again.

~SDC~

Dynamic tech tree generator, please!

End transmission.

~SDC~

Sounds like you are on a roll lets talk about what it will not do. You are packing in some great tools and fast coding to boot. That Dynamic tech tree generator sounds the most exciting.

~SDC~