Mormonism, Al Sharpton, Bigotry, and Catholicism

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As I mentioned on another blog, I have been blessed.  In being able to see several religions from the inside.  And JU has given me an opportunity to see different sects of my religion. 

I was raised Catholic.  I strayed,  Back in the days of the Tridentine Masses and all.  But I came back, once I understood the real meaning.  In my straying days, I tested/tasted some Protestant faiths.  Even when I came back, I tasted/tested them again as my parish was a nomad one. We worshipped in Episcopalian, Methodist, Baptist, and other churches before ours was built.  And in all of them I found God.

I am Catholic.  I beleive in the Creed of the church, and I try to live it.  But I have seen other faiths as well.  Not all, as I am the first to acknowledge.  But enough to know that my faith is for me, and that faith is the key.

I am lucky.  I have talked to many Rabbis as well on their faith, and  I understand and accept that their faith is a valid one.

I have knowns Mormons.  Before JU, just a few.  But JU was a great learning experience.  My last boss is a Mormon.  A great man! (If not too smart as he still refuses to bill his old employer for his expertise!  And I still call upon him for questions, which he does answer.  He really needs to learn the 5k rule).  And I have not seen anything that would indicate to me that they are not a true faith (just not mine) and true Christians.

Al Sharpton insinuated they are not.  More is the pity for him, not Mormons.

And I have seen the bigotry against Mormons.  And learned some history as well.  Are they pure and perfect?  Hardly.  But their history is not so dirty as one would say they are hipocrites.  They had a hiccup now and then (much less prononouced as the Catholic one).  As do I assume (bad word, but the only one that fits) all Christian faiths do.  As did the Faith of our fathers, Judism.

But I am not Klingon.  The sins of our fathers are not our sins.  I never owned slaves.  I am not a slave owner.  I have nothing to appoligize for. 

I did not persecute the Mormons.  I did not persecute the Jews.  I can accept them and embrace them as fellow human beings and acknowledge that their faith is valid.  And not betray my own.  The same with Muslims, Hindus and Taoists.

Yet recently, we have had an attack on Mormons.  To which, with almost no exception, JU rallied to condemn.  One Mormon, jokingly stated (paraphrasing) "it is ok. After all we are Mormons".

That is not acceptale to me.  Not from Al Sharpton, or anyone else.  IT IS NOT ACCEPTABLE!

Mormons have a belief that I do not subscribe to.  But that does not mean I cannot accept them, or accept attacks against them.  With the help of 50 years of experience, and many Mormon friends both in real life and here at JU, I refuse to accept such bigotry.  It is as abhorant as Imus' cracks (done with his acerbic wit, but still wrong).

And I will not accept bigtory, ignorant as well, against Catholics.  For in that, the purveyor shows not only their ignorance, but stupidity.  Ignorance is the lack of knowledge. Easily cured.  Stupidity is the rejection of knowledge,  due to preconceived and false notions, and is terminal.

As I said, recently we have been subjected to diatribes from without on Mormons.  By stupid people.  And yes, recently (by less famous people) we have been subjected to diatribes by stupid people on Catholocism.

I have been tolerant.  I guess I will in the future as ignorance is curable, stupiduty is not.  But I dont have to like it.

As for the Mormons?  Based upon my anecdotal experiences, I think they are one of the most devout Christians - as  faith - that I have ever known.  And I am proud to hear them speak each and every day.  To remind the Al Sharpton's what Folllowing Christ is all about.  And that goes for ones in my faith as well.

For the record, the Joke about "tip toeing in heaven walking past doors" (insert religion of faith), I do subscribe to.  There are many paths to the end, not all walk the same mile.  Believe as you do.  Live as you are taught.  The ends do not justify the means.  The end justifies the end.  When you get to the end, you have but 2 questions to answer.  One is yours.  The other is God's. 

I will not tiptoe past any doors (should I be so lucky).  I will open them and look for friends who I know are better than me.

6,419 views 21 replies
Reply #1 Top
When we studied and attended the Mormon church way back.....probably in the 70's they did not call themselves Christian. They called themselves Mormons. The same with the JW's (Jehovah Witnesses). There seems to be some confusion as to whether or not they WANT to be called Christian or not. I'll leave that to the Mormons here on JU, but at the time we worshipped with both groups they avoided that title.

As an Evangelical Fundamentalist Christian I do not put them in the same category as the historic Christian Church. There are certain tenants of the Historic Christian Church that both the JW's and Mormons don't believe and the Historic Christian Church doesn't fit their theology as well.

I think the Mormons and the JW's both tend to be some of the nicest people I've ever met regardless of their theology one way or the other. I have never met one from either group that I didn't like or not get along with.
Reply #2 Top
Thanks Dr. Guy!

We have an Article of Faith that basically states what you just said so well here...

"We claim the privilege of worshiping Almighty God according to the dictates of our own conscience, and allow all men the same privilege, let them worship how, where, or what they may."

Like in all groups, there are LDS members who forget this at times. There are members who shy away from people of other (or no) faiths, but the tenet is clear. Like you, we just want to be free to worship God the way we see fit. For me, it's my hope that everyone lives the faith they claim.

~~~~~

KFC:

True, there are many LDS members who shy away from the term "Christian". Unfortunatly there is a lot of animosity between LDS members and "Main Stream Christianity" so a lot of members think of bible bashing and confrontation. Sadly, from my memories being involved in such "bashing", it's started by a Mormon as often as the "Christian".

However, a person cannot be a member of The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-Day Saints without accepting Jesus Christ as our personal savior. As far as I know, that's what it takes to be a Christian. Whatever denomination a person chooses, as long as they accept Christ's atonement, I don't see any reason to think they aren't Christians.

As far as I'm concerned, only Christ Himself is in a position to decide otherwise.

I think the Mormons and the JW's both tend to be some of the nicest people I've ever met regardless of their theology one way or the other. I have never met one from either group that I didn't like or not get along with.


Thanks, your not so bad yourself ;~D
Reply #3 Top
I think the Mormons and the JW's both tend to be some of the nicest people I've ever met regardless of their theology one way or the other. I have never met one from either group that I didn't like or not get along with.


And in the final judgement (IMHO), that is what a good christian is all about.
Reply #4 Top
We have an Article of Faith that basically states what you just said so well here...

"We claim the privilege of worshiping Almighty God according to the dictates of our own conscience, and allow all men the same privilege, let them worship how, where, or what they may."


That should be a tenet of everyone. I know most religions do not have that (and I do understand why), but I dont think Jesus would disagree with that Article. After all, his parable about the Good Samaritan shows that he judged men not by their piousness, but their deeds. (Well, he did not judge them, but indicated they would be judged based upon them).
Reply #5 Top
great article doc, one of your best in a long time.. two cookies worth from me.
Reply #6 Top

great article doc, one of your best in a long time.. two cookies worth from me.

Your praise means more than any cookies or points.  Thanks Elie.  I wish I could do more like this, but doing 2 jobs means not much time.

But thank you again.

Reply #7 Top

WOW!  It has been a long time since I was featured!  Thank you Stardock!

Now about that funny little pain I have in my side........

Reply #8 Top
Thank you! We forget respect so often. God is God. We all stumble around finding him, but at least we need to just sit down and let him (terrible pronoun) come to us as he chooses, as we can receive him. why do we think we all have to receive God the same way?
Reply #9 Top

Thank you! We forget respect so often. God is God. We all stumble around finding him, but at least we need to just sit down and let him (terrible pronoun) come to us as he chooses, as we can receive him. why do we think we all have to receive God the same way?

Welcome Ennarath!  And thank you.  That is exactly how this is written, and how I feel.  I am fortunate in that I do not think I, or my religion, has a monopoly on it.  Sure!  it is easier for me to follow this path.  And I hope do it well.  But I am a fallible man.  And others have other ways.

Reading your great stories, I know you understand my faith.  Whether you agree or not, is not important.  But I also know you respect it.

I suspect you are on your own path, and while I cannot know you as a person (yet), I think I have drawn some insight into you as a person.  And that person I respect. 

No one can sit there and write what you do without some inspiration.  keep it up!  And thank you.

Reply #10 Top
God is God. We all stumble around finding him, but at least we need to just sit down and let him (terrible pronoun) come to us as he chooses, as we can receive him. why do we think we all have to receive God the same way?


Well said!


Congrats on the feature Doc!
Reply #11 Top

Well said!

Amen Donna! (to the quoted text)

And thank you on the feature.  I have written a lot better.  i guess Zoomba likes me (or Brad).

Reply #12 Top
Brilliant, Dr. Guy. Not only your point, but the eloquence with you presented it.
Reply #13 Top

Brilliant, Dr. Guy. Not only your point, but the eloquence with you presented it.

Kupe, with no offense to any others here at JU, that is the best kudos I have gotten at JU in my tenure.

Thank you.

Reply #14 Top
And in the final judgement (IMHO), that is what a good christian is all about.


Jesus answered, “The first is, ‘Hear, O Israel: the Lord our God, the Lord is one; 30 you shall love the Lord your God with all your heart, and with all your soul, and with all your mind, and with all your strength.’ 31 The second is this, ‘You shall love your neighbor as yourself.’ There is no other commandment greater than these.” Mark 12:29-31
Reply #15 Top

Reply By: Nadeon

Ok, now define it.  Is a samatarian any less equal than a "go to church" Christian?

In the end, I think that Jesus and God, wanted everyone to follow his example.

I am not a biblical scholar.  YOu can trump me on that.  But I do remember the lessons.  And those are the ones I follow.

Reply #16 Top

WOW!  It has been a long time since I was featured!  Thank you Stardock!


Now about that funny little pain I have in my side........




Congrats on the feature. Excellent article.
Reply #17 Top
Ok, now define it. Is a samatarian any less equal than a "go to church" Christian?


I was just pointing out that it's been "articulated" before; it wasn't meant as an attack on anyone's position by any means. I'm sorry it was perceived that way.

Ok, now define it. Is a samatarian any less equal than a "go to church" Christian?


Wasn't that the point of the parable? "Who is my neighbor?" I'll leave any defining to whomever feels up to the task of "knowing the mind of God".

I am not a biblical scholar. YOu can trump me on that.


Nor am I sir; well read perhaps, but am by no means a scholar, and would not presume to trump anybody, especially in matters of doctrine and faith. We all ultimately are accountable for our own actions before whatever deity one may subscribe to.

And for what it's worth, I was very pleased to see a contemporaneous exposition on the "Golden Rule".
Reply #18 Top
I'm sorry it was perceived that way.


I applogize if I came across as harsh. That was not my intention either. Thank you for explaining your position further.
Reply #19 Top
Good thread, Doc.
Reply #20 Top

Good thread, Doc.

Thanks Big Daddy!

Reply #21 Top
I was raised a Catholic. My mom tried to get me to go to church on Sundays but I chose to stop going cause I just kept falling asleep and felt it was an insult to her and the church. I guess I just seem to have a problem with listening to a person, in this case the Priest, reading the Bible and talking what he think it means. Especially when you go to a church that changes Priest so often like mine did. I also have a small problem with the Bible. Honestly i have never read it, have never really had any interest in the Bible. I feel it was made by man not by God.

I do believe in God, I believe in doing the right thing. I respect other people’s beliefs so long as they don't try to convert me with persistence. I can't stand people who just won't take no for an answer when it comes to me joining their church or faith. But that's just who I am. I don't know much about religion, about many of the phrases said here, but it seems that even with my ignorance to them I seem to follow them more or less. I guess I just have my own way of seeing the World. I'm not sure what religion belong to anymore, maybe I'm still a Catholic since it's the one religion that I feel most comfortable with. It’s just the way I chose to be.

To make matters worse, my 8 year old son is now asking me about God. I find myself at a lost, I do not wish to impose any particular religion on him, I would like for him to choose his own faith, to believe in what he want, but I also feel I have to guide him a little. Maybe you guys may have some advice for me on this, it would be well appreciated.