Games I want to make!

So many ideas, so little time

from JoeUser Forums

It's not easy being a gamer who also makes games. I wish I didn't love computer games so much. But I do. 

What's worse, I like a particular type of computer games that seems to be increasingly ignored even though I am certain there are markets for those games.  What that means is that both my desire as a gamer to make a game and my evil capitalistic goal to do something about that desire combine together.

I remember being told by two major publishers back before the first Galactic Civilizations on Windows that the turn based market was dead.  Mid last year when Galactic Civilizations II past the 200,000 mark, I felt pretty vindicated.  Sure, 200,000 is peanuts compared to say a major console game or a mega popular PC game even.  But if a team of a half dozen or so people can make a game that sells 200,000 copies, that's a pretty good thing I'd say.  Even if you want to look at it from a pure businesss point of view -- it's not how much you gross, it's how much you net.

For up and coming game designers out there who are full of ideas, the thing to remember is -- time is fleeting. 

I love space strategy games. That's pretty obvious.  I still play GalCiv II most weekends. For me, I play it in the debugger. If the AI does something I don't like, it gets tuned, fixed, tweaked.  I could do that forever.  But I don't want to just write space based strategy games. There's so many other games.

The team is working on a fantasy strategy game.  The game engine for it is amazing. Beyond anything that's been done before for this type of game. We're talking about a world in which you can zoom in and see individuals walking around in the woods but also be zoomed out to see the entire world in one smooth motion.  It's a live world.  But it's still 2 years ago. So don't get excited yet.  I'll be 37 years old then.

I also want to make an RPG.  A Baldur's Gate style RPG.  What I mean by that is one that is driven by the story. Sure, players can do a lot of other things too and have plenty of side quests but there's a main plotpoint that players are driven towards and they're playing a specific character that they control in a party of several other people who interact.  Ultima IV was one of my favorite games of all time.  Baldur's Gate, Planetscape Torment, these are games that I remember very fondly.  I'd love to make that kind of game.  But will there be time? People will want another GalCiv sequel at some point probably and the fantasy strategy game, assuming it's successful will take up time too.

And let's not forget Society which shares the same main engine as the fantasy strategy game. That's a long term project as well that is largely waiting for us to just get bigger to afford the infrastructure needed for it.  It was heart breaking to back off from that but we want to make sure we can do the game the justice and that means being a significantly bigger company than we are today. Can't make Society with a half dozen or even a dozen people. You need 20 people just in IT to do something like that.  We're getting there and the game itself continues development.

But you see the problem right? At some point, there's just not enough time to make all these games.  I don't want to be a consultant. I want to be in the thick of the game.  I like coding on the games too.  I like working on them day to day.  And even as I work on that, there's Stardock's primary business to be concerned about -- the desktop enhancements part (check out Stardock's home page and games barely get mentioned). And I love that stuff too. Just as much as the games.

So I work out the schedule... Okay, political machine 2008 in 2008, fantasy strategy game in 2009, some other game in 2010, society after that, rpg after that, and so forth.  By then, I'll be in my 40s! Good gravy.

Those of you who are reading this that are in your 20s -- woe to you. Your day is coming. I wrote the original GalCiv for OS/2 back in 1993 -- 14 years ago.  I was 21.  And then, one day in the blink of an eye I was 35 years old. Wife. 3 kids. My oldest son played Counterstrike with me the other day and Company of Heroes on my team. How did that happen? I'm too young to have a son that age! ;)

If I could just slow down time so that there's enough time to make all these games, that would be great. If anyone knows of any time machines, please let me know.

63,027 views 40 replies
Reply #1 from JoeUser Forums Top
Well I don't know about a time machine, but the obvious answer to this is, hire more employees. Namely, me. I've been trying to get in to Stardock for 3 years now. Hopefully the day comes that you'll actually need me. I think last I heard was that you werent hiring any more people for the games division until you found a lead developer. Has that happened yet? I don't want to bug you to death, but I'm ready to rock and roll. I've called you, emailed you, showed up AT the stardock office. I was born and raised in Plymouth, I think its time to reconsider bringing me on.

My portfolio:

Link
Reply #2 from GalCiv2 Forums Top
MoM's spiritual sequel is still in the works /thumbsup!
Multiplicity - Control multiple PCs using one keyboard and mouse
Reply #3 from GalCiv2 Forums Top
I think that it's important never to lose sight of the things you have accomplished over the years. At least some of those things which you have learned along the way are ways to avoid re-inventing the wheel and thusly save time.
Reply #4 from GalCiv2 Forums Top
2009??! I was hoping for it to arrive at January 2008!

....You can't skip that political machine game huh?
Reply #5 from JoeUser Forums Top
I lament the demise of the turn-based market but there are still a lonely few out there... and I buy em.
Reply #6 from JoeUser Forums Top
i, for one, am glad to hear about a new political machine. i enjoyed the 1st version. i must admit, i thought i'd have an easier time running as a democrat, but the reverse was true. but it was fun and interesting to run from both sides of the ol fence. i have some ideas for the next version, but i'm sure ya don't wanna hear em. lol
Reply #7 from GalCiv2 Forums Top
About the only thing in that list I wouldn't buy is Society (sorry guys, I don't do persistent online games, no matter who makes 'em). I would encourage a little caution with the RPG. You mention Baldur's Gate and Planescape, but those were actually very different games and, IMO, Planescape was nigh unplayable. Yes, I'm going to get a ton of hate for that, but if I want to read a novel I'll go to the library and pick one up. Planescape sacrificed gameplay for story (it was essentially the text equivalent of those JRPG's that are 90% cinematics and 10% gameplay), BG balanced the two beautifully. Please use the latter as your primary inspiration.
Reply #8 from JoeUser Forums Top
Yes, I'm going to get a ton of hate for that


Yeah you are . . . I maintain, it's the only RPG that I've bothered playing to the finish. I get too bored by most RPGs.

if I want to read a novel I'll go to the library and pick one up.


Reply #9 from GalCiv2 Forums Top
Fundamental difference of taste, SanChonino. I'm certainly glad you and so many others liked it, but considering the very small number of quality RPG's put out these days I'm hoping SD would choose a somewhat more "middle path" in designing theirs.

I should add to that earlier post "and for the love of god let us create our own characters." Lack of investment in the protagonist is one of many reasons that in a dozen or so tries I never made it further than a couple of hours into Planescape.
Reply #10 from JoeUser Forums Top
Well, I tend to agree with SanChonino. Torment had an excellent story because of its characters, and having the player decide the backstory of those characters would have either weakened the story or made it a very different game from what it turned out to be. However, as you say, to each his own. . . .

I think a Baldur's Gate-style RPG would be terrific. I'd even go so far as to recommend using 2D graphics with an isometric POV. It worked and worked brilliantly for the BG series. I think there's a little too much emphasis on whiz-bang super 3D graphics engines these days and not enough on old-fashioned storytelling.

Apparently, the RPG crowd has hijacked this post; oops.

Reply #11 from GalCiv2 Forums Top
No kidding we have, Warreni!

I'd *die* to have Stardock make a Baldur's Gate/Planescape: Tormet-style RPG. I mean, assuming the death came after playing the game, of course.

Past that, as an aspiring author, I understand the lack of time, Brad. I've got more fully-formed ideas running around in my head than there are words in this world to write about. But I've got to keep plugging away in RoughDraft to try to get it all down in publishable form before I die an early and tragic death.

At least game designers don't have *that* particular stigma to worry about.
Reply #12 from JoeUser Forums Top
If Stardock ever make a strategy game that follows my below principles, I'll buy it, even if it means having to run it on Windows:

1. Turn-based

I like playing a strategy game while reading news or watching a DVD, perhaps while listening to a podcast. Can't have the game demand all my attention.

2. In a window

I don't like fullscreen strategy games. Of course, a Windows fullscreen game will run ina window in Parallels.

3. No fancy graphics

I want the game to run fast and not interfere with whatever else my computer is doing.

4. Territories

No space, no planets, I want territories I can rule, defend, and attack from. There must be borders.

5. Diplomacy

I want the engine to pretend that the computer players are real and I can ally with them, have them surrender to me etc.

6. No annoying losing battles

The engine can cheat, I don't care, but if I find myself expecting to lose a battle even if my troops are stronger than the computer's, then something is wrong.

7. No cheap super-powerful weapons

Many strategy games implement, for some reason, a cheap super-power weapon that the computer players don't use. For example Civ2 had "diplomats", which were a lot cheaper for taking over enemy cities than troops. Alpha Centauri has spies who can take over not only cities but also all units in and around the city while costing, including take-over, less than a tenth of what the troops required to take the city would have cost. Such units completely replace all battles. It's boring.

(Same applies to real-time games like StarCraft with Protoss Templar.)

Alpha Centauri was the closest to perfection I have ever seen. But it has annoying bugs.
Reply #13 from GalCiv2 Forums Top
I wrote the original GalCiv for OS/2 back in 1993 -- 14 years ago. I was 21. And then, one day in the blink of an eye I was 35 years old. Wife. 3 kids. My oldest son played Counterstrike with me the other day and Company of Heroes on my team. How did that happen? I'm too young to have a son that age!


Hey, YOU have a paycheck, buddy! In 1993 (when I was 20), I wrote a handfull of term papers. in 2003, when I was 30, I wrote a handful of term papers. I've now been in "higher" education longer than I was in "lower" education, and I have a wife, one kid, a dog, and $200,000 in student loan debt. After insurance, tuition, taxes, etc., I come out below the poverty line. And I bet we both have exactly as many regrets... that being none. You've brought joy to thousands of people. Quite B***ching!
Reply #14 from GalCiv2 Forums Top
I remember being told by two major publishers back before the first Galactic Civilizations on Windows that the turn based market was dead.


Were these guys/gals?? you saw on drugs at the time? Was their evidence of shooting dope that you could see in their arms, or did they seem to be on crack or smoking pot??? Certainly, they have heard of the civilization series? MOO and MOO2??? I think it is a tragedy that most games are action type games and sports games. Sport games??? How many takes on playing football can there possibly be??? I say go play real football with your friends. You will actually feel the wind on your face, the agonizing of your muscles, the shock and pain of the tackle, and the graphics!!! Human vision of the real world ain't so bad as long as it is working ok

But how many chances do you get to be the leader of a space faring civilization??? Assumming it is even possible to travel to distant stars which current physics seems to say to the contrary (damn you Albert Einstein and your universal light speed limit!!!), it would be thousands of years before we have a working intersteller empire. Again, lots of assumptions here. Only one person would get the opportunity: the President of the world or our solar system or whatever. (maybe by then the concept of nations will be done away with and we will be just the human race?? - nah we need someone to go to war with, as I think we are a fairly warmongering race like the Drengin)

Have the fans take a vote! What should Stardock put their attentions on? Political machine?? Why would I want to simulate being a dishonest crooked bastard??? Galciv 3 (this time with much more improved planet invasion animation!!!!)? Hell yes!!!!!!!!!!!!!! That fantasy game? Yes. Balders's gate game. Maybe. Let the fans themselves vote......

Also, I am sure you guys have money. Hire some people!!! Steal them from other companies!!! Send in a team to capture Sid Meier and force him to work with stardock through brute force or pursuade him with your superior influence!!! Oh wait, sometimes I forget this is real life. sigh.

Reply #15 from GalCiv2 Forums Top
I await with impatience future games from Stardock. I haven't been deceived with the last two, and I don't think a fantasy-TBS will be a deception either.

However, when will you launch the appropriate website and forum? if you take player's suggestion...
Reply #16 from GalCiv2 Forums Top
Many strategy games implement, for some reason, a cheap super-power weapon that the computer players don't use. For example Civ2 had "diplomats", which were a lot cheaper for taking over enemy cities than troops.


Man that brings back memories!!! I played a Civ II hotseat game one day with one of my friends a couple years back. He did the cheesy diplomat / buy everything trick and he wailed on me!!!! I was rushing to get to democracy and thus at least make my cities immune to bribing. I can't remember if the Democracy form of government protected military units or not - it may have just made cities immune to diplomat bribing. My friend had a crap load of undeveloped cities. He wasted no time building any city improvements, and instead went to writing as quick as possible and did nothing but maximize his treasurey income and produce diplomats. I had superior technology, cities, military units, etc. but none of that mattered. I would send out knights to try and take out his diplomats, but while occasionally destroying a diplomat here and there, he would just purchase my knights and send my own troops against me!!!! Clearly, the diplomats were way over-powered, and I don't think they were ever intended to be.

Can you elaborate with the Protoss Templar? They were overpowered when it came to rushing? Those were the basic troops for the protoss right? A zergling rush could be just as effective if I remember right.
Reply #17 from JoeUser Forums Top
Those were the basic troops for the protoss right? A zergling rush could be just as effective if I remember right.


I'm confused, too. The Zealots were the basic troop for the Protoss. The Templar's couldn't attack, if I remember right, they just had some funky power that I can't remember, because I would always combine them into Archons and wail on everything. Those things were cool, man.
Reply #18 from GalCiv2 Forums Top
The Templar's couldn't attack, if I remember right, they just had some funky power that I can't remember


Psi Storm, bane of massed troops (zerg in particular).
Reply #19 from GalCiv2 Forums Top

If Stardock ever make a strategy game that follows my below principles, I'll buy it, even if it means having to run it on Windows:

Well let's see how GC2 fills your requirement

1. Turn-based

GC2 is turn based

2. In a window

GC2 can be played in a window

3. No fancy graphics

I want the game to run fast and not interfere with whatever else my computer is doing.

Playing GC2 at the tactical level (where everything on the map is an icon) should do the trick. But the CPU can be monopolized by something other than graphics: AI

4. Territories

No space, no planets, I want territories I can rule, defend, and attack from. There must be borders.

Well, that concept doesn't exist in GC2

5. Diplomacy

I want the engine to pretend that the computer players are real and I can ally with them, have them surrender to me etc.

Well you can ally with AI in GC2 and sometimes they may surrender to you. Now if you are speaking of coordinated attacks .....

6. No annoying losing battles

The engine can cheat, I don't care, but if I find myself expecting to lose a battle even if my troops are stronger than the computer's, then something is wrong.

I don't remember having seeing mention of that in the various GC2 report

7. No cheap super-powerful weapons

I don't think there is that kind of weapon in GC2.

It looks like GC2 can fill lots of your requirements. But it is in space ...

Reply #20 from JoeUser Forums Top

He wasted no time building any city improvements, and instead went to writing as quick as possible and did nothing but maximize his treasurey income and produce diplomats. I had superior technology, cities, military units, etc. but none of that mattered.


Exactly! It is most annoying, isn't it?


Can you elaborate with the Protoss Templar?


The mind storm easily kills very expensive Zerg units and costs NOTHING (in the long run). Templar are also not counted as attack units and will thus be the last attacked unless specifically targeted (meaning that Zerglings will attack poor defenseless honest Protoss Zealots before they attack the Templar cowards).

And Dark Templar have the change-sides magic trick. They can easily and as often as they like take over huge enemy units at no particular cost (they recharge for free). It's ridiculous and utterly boring. Instead of impressive battles between huge armies, you just take over the enemy's army. Why bother?

And EVERY strategy and tactics game seems to have a trick like that.

It's most annoying. At least in Alpha Centauri everything (really) was configurable and the buggy city-take over could be switched off.
Reply #21 from GalCiv2 Forums Top
I hear you about the Civ2 Diplomats, but complaining about Protoss Templar? WTF? There are lots of ways to counter that. Have you ever played StarCraft online against random opponents?
Reply #22 from GalCiv2 Forums Top
Dominions 3 is for me the game of the last 5 years. Its all i want in a strategy game and has the best mode for playing MP games.

Try something like that!
Reply #23 from GalCiv2 Forums Top
Stardock games are cool. I'm certain I'll be playing whatever they throw down the line, because Stardock seems to put its time into each game, individually developing them procisely. Blizzard, once upon a time, did that, but not even close to how Stardock has hanled there baby, GalCil games, those games are addictive. I remember Galciv entertained my buddies and I while we sat in the (Persian) gulf for no apparent reason.
Reply #25 from GalCiv2 Forums Top
i was told by a moron 12 yrs ago that pc's were not the career to be in lol, so never listen to those folks. just when u hear more n more bs like that from people, you should dive into those things even more just because they say dont. and im 38, so cry me a river you old fogey. youve got another 40+ yrs to make 40+ more games, not to mention the ones your kids will want you to make? GET TO WORK, IVE GOT TONS OF TIME ON MY HANDS OLD MAN!!!!!    (jk)